Race & Murder/ Strawperson of "only racism"

Charles Brown CharlesB at CNCL.ci.detroit.mi.us
Mon Apr 26 13:45:37 PDT 1999

>>> <EmaChissit at cs.com> 04/26/99 04:03PM >>>
CharlesB at CNCL.ci.detroit.mi.us writes:

>This thread is significant
> because it is "symptomatic of a larger problem many have of coming to grips
> with racism". A while ago I protested that a media headline saying "Group
> hated athletes the most". It started out "Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris
> hurled insults at Jews, blacks and Hispanics at Columbine High School. But
> they REALLY hated the athletes, who had power and popularity - everything
> they didn't."

Why is it so hard to believe that two young men in a predominantly white world REALLY hated jocks. Jocks who sometimes mocked them, who called them queers, who slammed them against walls, who belittled them and teased them?


Chas.: Why is it so difficult to understand that they could hate jocks and be racist too ? I mean beside the fact that you don't think admiring Hitler is some evidence of racism.


Why is it so difficult to believe that, in the first place, they felt alienated in a world in which social status is EVERYTHING and yet even their access to the money that bought them the symbols of status didn't necessarily place them in the ruling elite in the school we call Columbine but which stands in for EVERY SCHOOL?


Chas.: So, do you think members of the KKK ONLY hate black people ? You don't think members of the KKK might hate white people with higher status than them ? You think that if I attribute racism to someone, I think they can't have other motives or hatreds ? It is really pretty simple. You are making a kind of elementary logical error. Being alienated from their high school scene in general, hating jocks and all that DOES NOT CONTRADICT their simultaneously being racist.


Why is that hard to understand? Why is that not a significant social factor to explore. Why do we have to necessarily think that they were racists in the extreme? (((((((((((((((((

Chas. I am not having the least bit of trouble understanding it. It is as simple as the word "and". They were racist AND they hated jocks. You seem to think that if they hated jocks , they couldn't also be racist. Why exactly is that ? As to "exploring other social factors, I said nothing against that. You are the one who leapt to the conclusion that saying racism is a significant factor means there can't be other factors. I have often denounced the dog-eat-dog, rat race mentality that capitalism creates. I have "explored" in many situations. It dovetails with racism.


What evidence to you have that they were. Come on, fork it over. Tell me and everyone else that they set out to kill blacks and were primarily motivated by racism.

Come on. Show us what you've got. (((((((((((((((((((

CB: There's a lot of it in the news. Here's one :"Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris hurled insults at Jews, blacks and Hispanics". I heard the sheriff at a press conference over the weekend. He said from the evidence they had the boys seemed to be doing a "Nazi thing" and that the day of the incident was because it was Hitler's birthday. That is evidence of the type you ask for.

"Primarily"motivated is you playing games. Their racism was a significant factor in the sad mixture of thoughts that made them do it. Your effort to basically say that racism was NOT a significant factor is a disservice anyone trying to learn the lessons of this tragedy.

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