I don't think I'm oblivious. I've already conceded the saliency of some of the points. I'm not all that well informed about the whole matter -- e.g., I haven't read any books devoted to it. A good part of the argument here has been about the 'morally permissible' angle.
> > I think judges and juries are capable of deciding, if that's
what you mean, though perhaps not as well as I could.>
> But deciding on what basis?
The reality seems to be that a sprinkling of murderers are selected each year, and the reason why one murderer is selected and another is not are part arbitrary and part racially motivated. That some are convicted falsely is partly due to race and class as well. To me the most bothersome part is the innocent person falsely convicted and executed. Next is the bias in selection among murderers. Not bothersome to me is the fact of an actual murderer being executed.
I would not oppose some kind of campaign to ensure life imprisonment for the worst offenders, or to improve the justice system. But I refuse to engage in breast-beating when some miscreant gets his (or hers). And to excuse murderers as products of their environment, much less to suggest release of convicted criminals, as some here have suggested, is just whacko. And whacko is bad politics, really no politics. It's surrealism.
> (3) Systemic racial prejudice has already been demonstrated --
in
McClesky v. Kemp -- and the Supreme Court said this was not a
problem
unless one could prove SPECIFIC intent in the case being
appealed -- a
clearly impossible burden to meet.>
As I said above, I would prefer an impartial selection of murderers for execution, rather than a biased one.
> This is prima facia evidence that the system as a whole is
subject to
bias that no judge or jury, no matter how fair or just, can
correct.>
I don't think such a statement can be proven.
> Unless we're willing to execute tens of thousands of prisoners
a year it
must indeed be flexible.>
Here you seem to be saying that to be really fair, many more should be executed.
> It would be better if you considered how hard Blackmunn tried
to make
the death penalty work, operating from philosophic position
similar to
yours, before he finally gave it up as an impossible task.>
I've been known to change my mind, and I might if I investigated further. But the death penalty may not "work" and still not merit much attention if the worst outcome is an incomplete selection of awful criminals for execution. As I've said repeatedly, race/class bias is well-taken as a problem, and a high incidence of wrongful conviction as well. Execution of the McVeighs of this world is not.
mbs