Chechnya - a far off country

Russell Grinker grinker at
Mon Nov 8 23:05:45 PST 1999

This could run and run...

>Do you not agree with this argument then:
>"To carry on a war for the overthrow of the international bourgeoisie, a
>war which is a hundred times more difficult, protracted and complicated
>than the most stubborn of ordinary wars between states, and to refuse
>beforehand to manoeuvre, to utilize the conflict of interests (even though
>temprorary) among one's enemied, to refuse to temporize and compromise with
>possible (even though temporary, unstable, vacillating and conditional)
>allies - is this not ridiculous in the extreme" - From Left Wing Communism,
>an Infantile Disorder, Chapter 8 'No Compromises'
He talks about "unstable, vacillating and conditional" allies (he means other working class and national liberation organisations anyway) - not about getting into bed with your opponents. By the way, why is it that this particular Lenin piece is always quoted by people who seem to disagree with just about everything else he stood for?
>As a democrat, let alone anything else, I would like people not to be
>expelled from their homes for the colour of their skin, their religion or
>their language.

Who wouldn't agree? What however is the connection between stopping this and your proposals for working with forces which have no liberatory instincts at all?
>>What on earth is this global civil society? We don't share this
>It seems not. What are you doing here? Looking for proletarian jewels among
>the dross? Aren't there richer seams to be mined from your point of view?

Richer - in what sense?

>>Trotsky was opposed to calls for other imperialist countries to impose
>>sanctions on Italy. The point is not to encourage reliance on forces
>>merely have an interest in making the world sufficiently stable to allow
>>the resumption of exploitation.
>Could we have the direct quote please, so it is possible to compare it with
>the Lenin above?
>There is nothing in the Lenin quote about encouraging *reliance* on the
>temporary allies.

The essence of Leninism was to find ways of developing an independent working class outlook as a basis for independent action. You proposal is that some unknown progressive force called global civil society should cuddle up to the big powers to help sort out the World's problems.

If you want to join them in their crusade for the New World Order, do so. Just don't try to give the process a radical spin.

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