It's too facile to see a direct relationship between oppression and subjection to the legal apparatus. The reality is quite complex.
Christopher Rhoades Dÿkema
Justin Schwartz wrote:
> Despite the rhetoric, probably most of us on the list have fairly
> conventional views about criome and punishment, although we'd be likely to
> agree with Yoshie that the list if bad guys ought to be a little wider than
> it's usually drawn. Carrol, despite his crankiness, is really very nice amd
> would have no truck with pedophiles, etc.; he just thinks--I think
> naively--that there wouldn't be any people like that under socialism, or not
> any who couldn't be dealt with by a stern talking to.
>
> I will comment three things about punishment: First, theoretically, it is
> not easy to justify having the state impose harm on people even when they do
> harm to others, although I think that a defense of punishment can be
> constructed. Second, there is no doubt that as a society we in America are
> insanely punitive by world standards: we have two million people in custody,
> up from a few hundred thousand a quarter century ago,a nd ona per capita
> basis we punish ina league with Iran and China rather than with France and
> Germany--which latter societiesa re not exactlly overrun with thugs and
> goons. Third,a s Yoshie says, despite this, we don't get the very worst and
> most deserving of punishment--the Kissingers and Jack Welches and the like.
> So Carrol has gone overboard, but in the right direction.
>
> --jks
>
> >
> >Yoshie Furuhashi wrote: >The majority of murderers & pedophiles go
> >regularly unpunished today. >E.g., those who price food, clean water,
> >medicines, & other >necessities out of the hands of the poor; those who
> >refuse to make >safety equipment & procedures available to workers &
> >consumers; those >who order wars & economic sanctions; those who kill with
> >governments' >approval; sex tourists who patronize young prostitutes in
> >poor >nations, etc.
> >
> >As a mother, I always worry about food, clothing and shelter for my
> >children, but I cannot protect them from abductors, rapists or other
> >predators who should be shot after their fair trial. Of all of these we've
> >named, do you count yourself as one? Like that horrid man Carol, do you
> >think they should be allowed to roam free and do as they wish with nothing
> >done by the police? I don't know if what you say is the truth or not, I
> >have no experience with sanctions or sex tourists, but if some nation is
> >deserving, shouldn't they receive sanctions?
> >
> >I must surely be in the wrong place, if murderers, rapists and pedophiles
> >are defended here. That is a Japanese name, isn't it? Yoshie? Do you have
> >children? What do the authorities in Japan do with murderers and rapists
> >and pedophiles? I just finished a book that described the soap houses in
> >Japan. Isn't that the same sort of prostitution? Is it alright if it isn't
> >in a poor nation, if the sex tourist can afford it? Have you ever worked in
> >any of them?
> >
> >Catherine
> >
> >--
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