US recession, Steel, rail, teachers, Israel

Lisa & Ian Murray seamus at accessone.com
Mon Feb 5 14:33:09 PST 2001


GF: If I may skip over several steps of argument here, what I

think you're saying in essence is that growth is a political

need of the ruling class, rather than an economic need of

the community as a whole.

That being the case, the defect of the Greens' alleged

desire for zero growth which J.H. disparaged is not the

zero growth itself, but their omission of specifying the

concomitant requirement -- the overthrow or dissolution of

the class system and the class war that sustains it.

**********

While Green literature may not mention getting rid of the class system, many many greens realize the necessity of this. One can usually garnish their approach when they talk about ending adversarial democracy and predatory economics; it's a difference of metaphorical emphasis.

mbs: On a), I would say that insofar as growth is an expectation

of the masses, it becomes a 'need' for psychological

reasons and to rulers for political reasons (stability,

consent of the governed).

On b), the defect of ZG is the fact that advances in economic

justice usually require growth as a context -- since zero-

sum disputes are typically resolved in favor of the relatively

privileged. "Overthrow or dissolution . . . etc." taken in

isolation is just ultimatism, a substitute for politics in

the here and now. So this would be the exchange of one

form of unreality for another.

mbs

*********

Greens call for zero growth in the net energy flows through the economy [I leave aside the entropy/energy/exergy debate] and massive reductions of the effluent profiles of many industry sectors. They also encourage the search for property rights regimens that will create 1]the optimal depletion paths for resources that have no readily available substitutes--the buying time till we get much smarter argument -- and 2]facilitate the optimal yield strategies for each regenerative/renewable ecosystem, which involves detailed, and widely available knowledge of how each system works, so as to encourage participatory decisonmaking.

We need to adopt some variants of these research and policy proposals rather quickly if growth -suitably redefined- is to continue.

The work of Geoffrey Heal and Paul Ekins go quite far in spelling out policy applicable theory; Daly gives a great "pre-analytical" motivation/heuristic/paradigm shift blah blah blah.

To read them the way 'you know who' read Smith, Ricardo etc....... is a worthwhile challenge

Ian



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