Leo, this is tiresome. You must always be red-baiting. I am an unlikely target. If it weren't for you, I'd be the local right-winger. I am a fan of Hayek market economics. I am a long-time, proud, and unshamed liberal democrat. I have sworn several times to defend the Constitution of the United States, and I meant it. (I have some amendments I'd like to see, of course.) I am not a Leninist. I make no pretense to "revolutionary" credentials. In a practical sense,I have no idea what it would be to be a "revolutionary" in an advanced capitalist country today, and neither does anyone else. I was making fun of the idea of bloody red revolution. I have slammed Stalinism--here! on this list! during the last few days!--as hard as could be. I do not think, however, that armed struggle, in places where it makes sense, necessarily leads to the Gulag: the Sandinista experiment, among others, shows otherwise. That does not mean that it mskes sense as a political steategy.
And my point about social democracy was not the we should reconcile ourselves to it as all we can get--I still think that we can do better--but that everyone on this list supports it, at least as far as it goes. You say you support it too, but I don't think so. You ally yourself with forces who are basically committed not to advancing it, but to explaining and justifying why we can't get it, and to opposing all those forces and activities that might help achieve it. Who is iot who wants the ocean without the awful roar of its waters? I think it is clear what side you are on. You are a Democrat, but no democrat.
--jks
>
>Justin:
>
>So good to know that I still perform that vital rhetorical function for you
>of confirming your revolutionary credentials. Too bad that you are the only
>person who cares whether or not you have those credentials.
>
>What is "bloodly red revolution" [need I remind you, a term of your
>creation]
>if not the product of the "you have to break some eggs to make an omelet"
>worldview of Leninism-Trotskyism-Stalinism? If not, exactly what and who is
>responsible for the Gulag, for the Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution,
>the
>Khymer Rouge and so on? After a century of "bloody red revolution," it
>doesn't seem that difficult to me to draw the lines between the dots, as
>this
>is one of those "the shortest distance between two dots is a straight line"
>phenomena. And it seems fairly obvious to me that those who revel in their
>Leninism today do so in full knowledge of what it entails, of the record of
>innocent blood which was shed, however you want to describe that. Those who
>claim otherwise are no different from those who deny that HIV is the
>causative agent in AIDS, or those who deny the existence of the Nazi
>genocide
>-- willful deniers of the obvious. [This is why, incidentally, that I think
>Zizek's current "tarrying" with Lenin is so grossly irresponsible, and
>reflects a cavalier view of politics as language games _without_
>consequences.] When it comes to picking sides, I know which side I am on,
>in
>the here and now, on this question, Justin; the only credentials I need are
>those of a democrat. It seems far easier for you to speculate about where
>you
>and I may find ourselves on the sides of future conflicts then to make a
>similar unambiguous stand on Leninism and its progeny.
>
>Now, it seems that you are prepared to settle for "social democracy," so
>long
>as there is no viable agent, in even the most embryonic or inchoate form,
>to
>bring it into being. As soon as one mentions that there might be the
>makings
>of such political and social forces, you have to run to an exegesis of how
>inadequate they are. In order to meet your qualifications, the Progressive
>Caucus should give up their involvement in the actual, political struggles
>in
>the here and now, forget about issues such as Bush's tax cut or education
>vouchers, and articulate a social democratic program that has no chance of
>being realized in the short term. You have a way of even making social
>democracy seem utopian!
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