On Wed, 18 Jul 2001, Max Sawicky wrote:
> I wasn't aware of the marriage situation in Israel. Not that this is
> any excuse for it, but the Catholic priest we approached refused to
> marry me to my Catholic bride to be. Sure, state sanction or lack
> thereof is a different thing.
>
> Given the Falasha point, and the fact of many differences in Ashkenzai
> and Sephardim, it doesn't seem right to characterize Israeli
> chauvinism as 'racial.' It's certainly nasty enough. It is quite true
> that race can be socially constructed, but in Israel to construct a
> race out of Jews would seem to be a daunting task. Of course, you can
> be racist re: some other group without being a race unto yourself.
>
> This sub-thread started in reference to the democratic secular state
> (DSS) idea, which is the way the Palestinians used to front
> themselves. But to have such a state one must have an absence of sharp
> inter-group animosity, and as Brad pointed out there is a manifest
> lack of evidence of this on Palestinian side, not to mention the
> Jewish side.
>
> The unrealism of the DSS position, notwithstanding its utter
> reasonableness in the abstract, rules it out as a short- or
> medium-term practical solution.
>
> I still think the Palestinians were never stronger politically than
> when they were mobilized on a non- or quasi-non-violent basis. It
> looks more and more like they are now the ones who are going to be
> driven into the sea.
>
> mbs
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-lbo-talk at lists.panix.com
> [mailto:owner-lbo-talk at lists.panix.com]On Behalf Of C. G. Estabrook
> Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2001 4:44 PM
> To: lbo-talk at lists.panix.com
> Subject: RE: "Zionism"
>
>
>
> That's handled by having essentially no civil marriage in Israel. (I'm
> told that Cyprus is the preferred spot for marriages Israel doesn't
> permit.) There are a lot of round-about systems for maintaining the
> racialist nature of the state -- e.g., privileges made available to
> veterans, who include almost all Israelis and very few others. --CGE
>
>
> On Wed, 18 Jul 2001, Max Sawicky wrote:
>
> > Civil marriage between Jew and non-Jew is "not allowed" in Israel?
> >
> > Can a Falasha Ethiopian refugee marry an Askenazi? And if so, is this
> > not racial inter-marriage?
> >
> > mbs
> >
> >
> >
> > Of course there are preferences for religious groups (e.g., yeshiva
> > students) but much more important are the privileges for one racial
> > group, the majority of whom are not religious. As the late Israel
> > Shahak was wont to point out, Israel within the Green Line is a racist
> > state, with laws similar to those of apartheid South Africa: e.g.,
> > racial identity cards must be carried, no intermarriage is allowed
> > with the dominant racial group, and none but members of that group can
> > own land in more than 93% of the national territory. --CGE
> >
> >
> > On Wed, 18 Jul 2001, Michael Perelman wrote:
> >
> > > The first step would be to make it a secular state with no preferences
> for
> > > religious groups.
>
>