Doug Sez:
>
> So ObL is a Saudi, many of his associates are Arabs, and they're all
> holed up in a non-Arab country. Islam isn't a nationalist or a racist
> religion, is it? It's universalist towrds its adherents. Iran is a
> theocracy, but it has elections and a parliament. So we have a
> non-ethnic, non-nationalist, non-statist formation with no
> significant industry aside from a chain of honey retailers - that is
> yet still somehow fascist. I don't get it.
>
> Doug
>
...not even trying...
Ethnic includes religion.
Not all theocracies are fascist.
Saudi Arabia is a theocracy that is not quite fascist. (despite my respect for Katha Pollitt)
These are not just Arab nationalists, they are Islamic Nationalists. They want many Islamic theocracies. Talib=student and in this context we are talking about a movement of Islamic theology students who are seeking to purify the religion.
One interpretation of Islam--the majority interpretation-- Is that it is universalist towards its adherents. ObL despises the reactionary fundamentalist Islamic system in Saudi Arabia (the Wahhabi movement) because he sees it as a whore for the US infidels.
Note that the major Black Muslim movement in the US is critical of Farrakhan and the Nation of Islam because of their bigotry towards Jews and White people in general, and because they would not consider allowing White members.
Not all fundamentalist Muslims agree with each other. Not all fundamentalist Muslims are fascists. Not all fundamentalist Muslims are theocrats. Not all theocratic Muslims are fascists. Some theocratic Islamic fundamentalists are fascists.
Not all fundamentalist Christians agree with each other. Not all fundamentalist Christians are fascists. Not all fundamentalist Christians are theocrats. Not all theocratic Christians are fascists. Some theocratic Christian fundamentalists are fascists.
Not all fundamentalist Jews agree with each other. Not all fundamentalist Jews are fascists. Not all fundamentalist Jews are theocrats. Not all theocratic Jews are fascists. Some theocratic Jews are fascists.
Fascist movements are different from fascist states.
Fascist movements can exist in exile.
Fascism denounces modernity while using modern tools of mass communication. Thus Herf calls it "Reactionary Modernism."
Fascism has nothing to do with existing industry and everything to do with reacting against both capitalism and communism and the alienation created in the modern world by industrialization and now corporate globalization.
ObL is not in Afghanistan for the waters. He was not misinformed. He was thrown out of Saudi Arabia for trying to foment revolutionary Islamic terrorism in an effort to expunge western influence from Islamic countries, especially those with major religious shrines.
ObL would be a nationalist real quick if he could take over Saudi Arabia, dontyathink?
Aryan Nations is a US fascist movement. Nations. Plural. They want to establish many Aryan Nations around the world. It is nationalist in desire and yet internationalist in scope.
Here is a version of Griffin's definition with particulars inserted in brackets:
= = = = =
[ ObL has crafted a version of theocratic fascism that has resulted in a ] modern political ideology that seeks to regenerate the social, economic, and cultural life of ...[ all Islamic countries ] by basing [ them ] on a heightened sense of national belonging or ethnic identity [ rooted in a militant and nasty version of Islam rejected by most fundamentalist Muslims].
[ ObL rejects liberal ideas such as freedom and individual rights, and ... [ would likely press for ] the destruction of elections, legislatures, and other elements of democracy [ in most existing Islamic countries in an effort to impose his fanatic version of Islam ].
Despite the idealistic goals of fascism, attempts to build fascist societies have led to wars and persecutions that caused millions of deaths. As a result, fascism is strongly associated with right-wing fanaticism, racism, totalitarianism, and violence.
= = = = =
-Chip Berlet