"post-leftism"

[Tom Wheeler]

From: <billbartlett at dodo.com.au>
> Whether people are dispersed by violent force or economic force is
irrelevant. Obviously few people are going to freely choose to abandon
comfortable lives made possible by modern industrial infrastructure, for a
primitive life of subsistence agriculture. They would have to be forced to
do it one way or another. Chuck's denials are cowardly and dishonest.
>
> You can drive them out of the cities at the point of a gun, or you can
starve them out.  Either way, many millions will die and the rest will
become serfs in a new feudal economy. The economic basis of society
determines what sort of social system is possible. The most advanced social
system possible in an agricultural society, without modern technology, is
feudalism.
>
> To advocate destroying the material basis for modern society, which is
also the indispensable material basis for a future socialist society, is
insane. To advance such rhetoric in the name of socialism is an intolerable
libel against socialists of all stripes.
>
> Chuck's rants against modern industrial means of production are
intrinsically reactionary and anti-social. Such deranged rhetoric should
probably be criminalised, their authors thrown in a jail, along with other
potential war criminals. The man is dangerous. Like I say, a potential Pol
Pot.

Ah yes, another leftist calling for the imprisonment of people for *thought
crimes*. Lovely.

In the real world, we have had *forced* industrialization over the past
century in many parts of the world. It was often resisted, sometimes
violently. Force is also used against folks in the global South to help
maintain the comfortable modern industrial society we have in the North. If
they walk off the job and a good number of workers in the North join them in
solidarity, or if there is a revolution and a number of folks refuse to
return to their demeaning jobs, are you going to jail them too since they
then pose a threat to your precious lifestyle? Does this mean you support
sending in the Marines to protect the *American way of life*? At what point
do you support coercion of others in order to maintain your comfortable
lifestyle? - Tom