<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> <TITLE>Message</TITLE> <STYLE type=text/css>BLOCKQUOTE { MARGIN-TOP: 0px; MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px } DL { MARGIN-TOP: 0px; MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px } UL { MARGIN-TOP: 0px; MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px } OL { MARGIN-TOP: 0px; MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px } LI { MARGIN-TOP: 0px; MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px } </STYLE> <META content="MSHTML 5.50.4916.2300" name=GENERATOR></HEAD> <BODY> <DIV> <DIV>Bill Bartlett<BR><BR></DIV></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV>It sounds like Californa is a relatively progressive police state, as police states go. But I don't think I'd feel safe living in a jurisdiction that has abolished the presumption of innocence, permitting the police to imprison people without trial.</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV>Which party was responsible for that anyhow? Not that it matters, if as you say the Democrats have full control of the legislature they could have changed the law back.</DIV> <DIV><BR> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#0000ff></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=033461214-04102002><FONT color=#0000ff>That is a hyperbole - I have not seen the police arbitrarily arresting people in this country, so in reality you have nothing to fear - you just make a dramatic statement.  </FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=033461214-04102002><FONT color=#0000ff></FONT></SPAN> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=033461214-04102002><FONT color=#0000ff>Arresting delinquents is a different thing, and legal formalities are not alwyas followed.  </FONT></SPAN><SPAN class=033461214-04102002><FONT color=#0000ff>But that is at best a minor issue.  Police going after delinquents is a good thing, because delinqunts victimize predominatly low income people and minorities rather than upper echelons of society or, for that matter, campus residents - as crime stats clearly show.  Most common folks like strong law enforcement, because it directlly benefits them by preventing hoodlums from vicitmizing them.  The supposedly "progressive" preoccupation with criminal justice (calls for leniency, protection of criminal's "civil liberties" etc.) - is quite misguided.  It assures that progressives are seen as out of touch dogmatics who care more about principles than people's safety.  Not to mention the fact that putting an individual's freedom before collective rights and safety surely sounds strange among the self-professed champions of social justice.</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=033461214-04102002><FONT color=#0000ff></FONT></SPAN> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=033461214-04102002><FONT color=#0000ff>Perhpas the left would no be so marginalized in this country if it adopeted a more pro-working class, tough on crime stance.  Nathan's post is a step in the right direction.</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=033461214-04102002><FONT color=#0000ff></FONT></SPAN> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=033461214-04102002><FONT color=#0000ff>wojtek</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=033461214-04102002></SPAN> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=033461214-04102002><FONT color=#0000ff></FONT></SPAN> </DIV> <DIV><SPAN class=033461214-04102002> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>