<HTML>In a message dated 12/5/2002 3:26:21 PM Eastern Standard Time, nathanne@nathannewman.org writes: <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">To repeat, and repeat-- I don't like the CTV pushing for the ouster of Chavez, but you seem to think that this means the government has the right to jail CTV's leaders and oust them. Leftwing unions and parties around the world are looking for the chance to oust rightwing regimes. Your logic is the same as the anticommunist authoritarian idea-- preemptive action in defense of the state, civil liberties and international labor rights be damned. -- Nathan Newman </BLOCKQUOTE> If AFL-CIO leaders had been plotting the overthrow of the US Government, they would probably be jailed (if they failed, that is).  Nine months after the leader of the CTV openly plotted to overthrow the governtment of Venezuela he is still in charge of the union and plotting with the same people.   I think that is pretty bad... I also belong to a listserv that discussed the work of Silvio Rodríguez, a wonderful Cuban singer-Songwriter.  People from all over Latin America subscribe to the list.  The list is pretty left, however the subscribers from Venezuela are almost all against Chávez.  I suspect you have to be middle class to have Internet Access in Venezuela.  The subscribers from all other countries in Latin America (Chile, Argentina, Cuba, Colombia, etc.) are almost all in favor of the Government of Venezuela.  The main complaint that Venezuelan subscribers had was that Chávez took part of the money that the Govt gave to private schools and gve it to public schools.  Outside of that, they pretty much agree with the policies of Chávez.  The other big problem they have with him is his rethoric against the rich and the media.  According to the e-mails I have read, Venezuelan society is so much polarized by this that they are talking in terms of civil war.  Any person that says anything positive about Chávez gets in a shouting match with pro-Chávez people and vice-versa.  The diferrence as I see it is that the people with the power are against Chávez and they are getting support from the US.</HTML>