[lbo-talk] Ambigious Doug

[andie nachgeborenen]

There is some ort of deep confusion here in this
discussion, running together (a) belief in the
supernatural, (b) theism, (c) religion, and (e) belief
in ghosts or spirits. Some of religions are
nontheistic -- Taoism, Zen. Some "theistic" religions
are really just spirit or ancestor worship -- most
traditional animistic religions, traditional Japanese
rreligion. Even some theistic religions (Desism,
Utitarianism) reject the "supernatural," which can
mean anything from a God tthat is transcendental as
opposed to immanent to a Gods that do miracles like
Superman. Moreover it is possible to believe in
ghosts, spirits, or an afterlife without any theistic
beliefs of any sort or any religious commitments. As
for whether atheism is a recent innovation, maybe at
the official level. But Carlo Ginzberg gas done some
work (see his The Worms and the Cheese) that suggests
taht it may have been common in early modern or late
medieval Europe. jks

--- Chris Doss <itschris13 at hotmail.com> wrote:
> 
> >So, what did all that mean? I have no idea. But it
> did happen, and it led 
> >me
> >to read up on spectral occurrences, vapors, ghosts,
> etc. There's something
> >to it, I think. It's part of existence, but to what
> degree, and whether 
> >it's
> >tied to any religious belief I cannot say. On that
> point I remain agnostic.
> >
> >DP
> ---
> Thanks Dennis.
> 
> Everytime I read some attempt to "explain" religious
> belief and/or 
> "supernatural" phenomenon on a sociological basis I
> think, um, could it 
> possibly be the case that such phenomenon are to
> some extent real? Belief in 
> them is a near-universal human characteristic.
> 
> In fact, historically, atheism and/or agnosticism is
> just weird. Has there 
> ever been an atheistic pre-modern society? Has there
> ever been a pre-modern 
> society that didn't believe in ghosts and/or have
> some sort of ancestor 
> cult? Either there is _some_ sort of reality
> underlying them, or it must be 
> hardwired into the human brain, methinks.
> 
>
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