While both examples are grossly simplified it shows the fallacy of believing that taking a catastrophists stand necessitates a willingness to put up with greater numbers of "real people ... dying real deaths". While you have not expressly stated you believe as much you and a few others have implied that this is your belief. I am curious as to why?
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Carrol Cox wrote:
The way the alternatives are being set up is all wrong.
ALL routes are gradualist routes. REPEAT
ALL routes are gradualist routes.
REPEAT IN OTHER WORDS. Revolution is every bit as gradualist as any other route one can choose.
The question is not gradual or fast. The question is what kind of policy (without stupid labels) will achieve two things
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Yes, the choices I offered were very simple and lacked nuance. No argument there.
My purpose, to be honest, was not to cover all the bases in a relatively brief post or present a cogent philosophical position (or even a practical guide to action) but break us out of the circular arguments dominating the thread which descended at points to bizarreness (the *agent baiting* someone mentioned) and inflammatory rhetoric.
I wanted to present a different way of looking at the topic at hand. Inelegant? Yes. I was dismayed by the tone and simply wanted to get something out there.
As regards my own beliefs, I'll have to get some work done here (bills must be paid and all that) and spend some time thinking it through comprehensively before committing fingers to keyboard with a statement I consider thoroughly cooked and ready to serve.
I will say, however, that I believe John Thornton's correct when he says there seems to be an assumption in the air about differing amounts of suffering (if I may use my own *silly* terms one final time) between *catastrophist* and *gradualist* modes of action. At the moment, I cannot definitively say why though I have several hunches.
Also...
Yes Carrol, you are right; all routes are *gradualist* since no political order is created instantaneously out of thin air.
DRM
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