<DIV>White collar crooks (including my clients) no longer get a free pass. I'm not sure of your point, though. We are supposed to be sympathetic to murderers (including my clients), rapists, thugs, and drug dealers because (or when) they are poor and minorities, because people from deprived backgrounds can't be expected to be better than that? Cops lie, sure, what's your point? I talk to my clients. I think I can appraise whether they did it. They almost always did. I never ask them whether they did; I don't want to know for sure. I've also seen the evidence in hundreds of criminal cases. There were a handful where I thought there was reasonable doubt. The evidence is almost never the unsupported testimony of cop against defendant. And the budget crisis is hurting the state courts. Your point? jks<BR><BR><B><I>R <rhisiart@charter.net></I></B> wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid"> <META content="MSHTML 6.00.2800.1170" name=GENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> <DIV><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#008000 size=2>in my not so humble opinion, the issue isn't so much who's guilty and who isn't but how many of the connected are never charged.  and the emphasis on punishing the little guy while white collar crime is passed over.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#008000 size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#008000 size=2>ever met a cop who told the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth on the witness stand?</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#008000 size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#008000 size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#008000 size=2>how are budget cuts in your state effecting the courts?</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#008000 size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#008000 size=2>R</FONT></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #008000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=swillsqueal@yahoo.com.au href="mailto:swillsqueal@yahoo.com.au">Mike Ballard</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=lbo-talk@lbo-talk.org href="mailto:lbo-talk@lbo-talk.org">lbo-talk@lbo-talk.org</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, June 23, 2003 2:56 PM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [lbo-talk] Framed (Was Everything's coming up roses)</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV>All the public defenders and criminal defense lawyers<BR>(I am one) I know <BR>agree that almost all their clients are guilty --<BR>probably of the <BR>things for which they were charged, or worse. jks<BR><BR>Kelley wrote:<BR><BR>As a public defender once <BR>told me, "Most people that<BR>end up in my office are poor; they're guilty of<BR>something."<BR><BR>He grew up poor, Hispanic, in Texas. He became a PD<BR>because he had ideals,once.<BR><BR><BR>Kelley <BR>*******************<BR>Mike Ballard <<A href="mailto:swillsqueal@yahoo.com.au">swillsqueal@yahoo.com.au</A>> quoting Mark<BR>Twain wrote:<BR><BR>"The lack of money is the root of all<BR>evil."<BR><BR>---Mark Twain<BR><BR>Charles Dickens wrote:<BR><BR>>From the foldings of its robe, it brought two<BR>children; wretched, abject, frightful, hideous,<BR>miserable. They knelt down at its feet, and clung upon<BR>the outside of its garment. <BR><BR>"Oh, Man! look here. Look, look, down here!" exclaimed<BR>the Ghost. <BR><BR>They were a boy and a girl. Yellow, meagre, ragged,<BR>scowling, wolfish; but prostrate, too, in their<BR>humility. Where graceful youth should have filled<BR>their features out, and touched them with its freshest<BR>tints, a stale and shrivelled hand, like that of age,<BR>had pinched, and twisted them, and pulled them into<BR>shreds. Where angels might have sat enthroned, devils<BR>lurked, and glared out menacing. No change, no<BR>degradation, no perversion of humanity, in any grade,<BR>through all the mysteries of wonderful creation, has<BR>monsters half so horrible and dread. <BR><BR>Scrooge started back, appalled. Having them shown to<BR>him in this way, he tried to say they were fine<BR>children, but the words choked themselves, rather than<BR>be parties to a lie of such enormous magnitude. <BR><BR>"Spirit! are they yours?" Scrooge could say no more. <BR><BR>"They are Man's," said the Spirit, looking down upon<BR>them. "And they cling to me, appealing from their<BR>fathers. This boy is Ignorance. This girl is Want.<BR>Beware them both, and all of their degree, but most of<BR>all beware this boy, for on his brow I see that<BR>written which is Doom, unless the writing be erased.<BR>Deny it!" cried the Spirit, stretching out its hand<BR>towards the city. "Slander those who tell it ye! Admit<BR>it for your factious purposes, and make it worse. And<BR>abide the end!" <BR><BR>"Have they no refuge or resource?" cried Scrooge. <BR><BR>"Are there no prisons!" said the Spirit, turning on<BR>him for the last time with his own words. "Are there<BR>no workhouses?" The bell struck twelve. <BR><BR>Scrooge looked about him for the Ghost, and saw it<BR>not. As the last stroke ceased to vibrate, he<BR>remembered the prediction of old Jacob Marley, and<BR>lifting up his eyes, beheld a solemn Phantom, draped<BR>and hooded, coming, like a mist along the ground,<BR>towards him.<BR>**************<BR><BR>F. Engels wrote in his 1886 intro to CAPITAL vol I:<BR><BR>The sighed for period of prosperity will not come; as<BR>often as we seem to perceive its heralding symptoms,<BR>so often do they again vanish into air. Meanwhile,<BR>each succeeding winter brings up afresh the great<BR>question, "what to do with the unemployed"; but while<BR>the number of the unemployed keeps swelling from year<BR>to year, there is nobody to answer that question; and<BR>we can almost calculate the moment when the unemployed<BR>losing patience will take their own fate into their<BR>own hands. <BR><BR><BR><BR> <BR><BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>*****************************************************************<BR>The unreal unity proclaimed by the spectacle masks the class division underlying the real unity of the capitalist mode of production. What obliges the producers to participate in the construction of the world is also what excludes them from it. What brings people into relation with each other by liberating them from their local and national limitations is also what keeps them apart. What requires increased rationality is also what nourishes the irrationality of hierarchical exploitation and repression. What produces society's abstract power also produces its concrete lack of freedom.<BR><BR><A href="http://profiles.yahoo.com/swillsqueal">http://profiles.yahoo.com/swillsqueal</A><BR><BR>__________________________________<BR>Do you Yahoo!?<BR>SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month!<BR><A href="http://sbc.yahoo.com/">http://sbc.yahoo.com</A><BR>___________________________________<BR><A href="http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk">http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk</A><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><p><hr SIZE=1> Do you Yahoo!?<br> <a href="http://pa.yahoo.com/*http://rd.yahoo.com/evt=1207/*http://promo.yahoo.com/sbc/">SBC Yahoo! DSL</a> - Now only $29.95 per month!