<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1"> <META content="MSHTML 6.00.2800.1276" name=GENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#000080 size=2>what's even more repugnant is that cheney and the US military plans to torture him.   </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><FONT size=2><FONT color=#000080><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#000080 size=2></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#000080 size=2><FONT face="Times New Roman"><FONT color=#000000 size=3><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#000080 size=2>When asked by a journalistic talking head if saddam would be tortured, rummy responded questions like that seem so, well, unfair. "We don't torture people."  </FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#000080 size=2><FONT face="Times New Roman"><FONT color=#000000 size=3><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#000080 size=2></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT><FONT><FONT><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><FONT size=2><FONT color=#000080><FONT>Rummy was followed later by a military guy who said they would certainly deprive him [Saddam] of sleep--"he won't have any sleep cycle at all."</FONT>   </FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT><FONT><FONT><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><FONT size=2><FONT color=#000080></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT><FONT><FONT><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><FONT size=2><FONT color=#000080>which we all know isn't torture.</FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><FONT size=2><FONT color=#000080><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#000080 size=2><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=#000000 size=3></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#000080 size=2>and that's the least of it.  i guess a guy has to be healthy to be tortured.  or perhaps the believe he's keeping WMD down his throat.</FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode"><FONT size=2><FONT color=#000080><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#000080 size=2><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=#000000 size=3></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#000080 size=2>R</FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Lucida Sans Unicode" color=#000080 size=2><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=#000000 size=3></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV></FONT> <BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000080 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=sokol@jhu.edu href="mailto:sokol@jhu.edu">Wojtek Sokolowski</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=lbo-talk@lbo-talk.org href="mailto:lbo-talk@lbo-talk.org">lbo-talk@lbo-talk.org</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, December 16, 2003 6:40 AM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [lbo-talk] lynching [was: Saddam captured]</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV>> >Brian Siano opined:<BR>> ><BR>> ><BR>> >>Looks to me as though Saddam's getting medical attention, to make<BR>sure<BR>> >>he's healthy enough for incarceration and trial.<BR>> >><BR>> >><BR>> ><BR>> >Why bother with such formalities?  You, your "commander in chief,"<BR>the<BR>> >majority of your countrymen, and above all the media have already<BR>> >pronounced him guilty.<BR>> ><BR>> ><BR>> And with good reason. You may wish to acknowledge this.<BR>> <BR>> But, if you want to be pedantic enough to insist that only a trial can<BR>> establish his guilt, you'd have to give Hitler and Stalin the benefit<BR>of<BR>> the doubt as well.<BR><BR>If I wanted to be pedantic enough I would point out that Mr. Hussein is<BR>being virtually lynched by the US lynching mob - an activity that is an<BR>integral part of  the US history and mentality.  The difference between<BR>lynching and justice is that in the former the deeds of the person<BR>subjected to public humiliation or punishment are rationalizations<BR>rather than for that humiliation.  That is to say, a person joins a<BR>lynching mob (or a pogrom, for that matter) because it gives him an<BR>opportunity to assail a token scapegoat - usually a member of an<BR>unpopular minority, such as Negro, a Jew, a homosexual, or simply an<BR>outsider.  <BR><BR>Lynching is a process whereby the participants focus their fear and<BR>hatred on an effigy and destroy that effigy to relieve themselves of<BR>their own fears and frustrations - but then they rationalize their own<BR>despicable actions in terms of meting out "justice" by pointing out to<BR>the real or perceived evil deeds that the victim had committed.<BR>However, an important element of this process is that these purported<BR>deed by themselves would never trigger "meting out of justice" (as in<BR>case of court trial).  In other words, the deeds of that sort are<BR>committed all the time and the participants of a lynching mob either<BR>know but do nothing about them, or do not care to pay any attention to<BR>those deeds.  They go to action only when they receive a signal from<BR>some sort of authority figure (a government official, religious leader,<BR>the media, or even a self-styled agitator) that it sis the "open season"<BR>for hunting down certain types of bad guys.  <BR><BR>The treatment Mr. Hussein received from the American people has all the<BR>signs of lynching.  These concerned US citizens did not give a shit when<BR>Mr. Hussein was gassing people for the US and NATO (Kurds were a threat<BR>to Turkey, which was crucial member of NATO containment of x-USSR) nor<BR>did they give a shit about Pinochet, Noriega, Sukharto and assorted<BR>butchers on their payroll.  These stalwarts of individualism and<BR>independence from the government started being concerned about a<BR>"threat" posed by Mr. Saddam only after the government cued them to do<BR>so.  Just like in the 'good old days' when somebody cued them to string<BR>up a Negro.<BR><BR>This is, btw, what I hate the most about the US and its people.  You can<BR>find the lynching mob mentality in virtually any country, but only the<BR>US-ers think that they attained a level of civilization never achieved<BR>by any other human society.  It is that contradiction between the<BR>hideous US reality and lofty standards by which the US-ers want to be<BR>judged that makes the US look particularly despicable to the outsiders,<BR>and makes people dancing in the streets when something bad happens to<BR>it.  <BR><BR>Wojtek<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>___________________________________<BR><A href="http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk">http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk</A><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>