[lbo-talk] RE: Out of Iraq (Lombardi, previous Out of Iraq)

John Bizwas bizwas at lycos.com
Wed Oct 6 03:20:47 PDT 2004


Someone asked about 'winning'. I think the world historic question about winning might be something like the following: Who WON the 15 year long US-Iraq Conflict? What sort of post-war society resulted in Iraq? What sort of post-war society resulted in the USA?

For the US nationalists (including quite a few 'leftists'), a brink draws into view, as they are forced to contemplate the unthinkable: A few thousand rag-tag Iraqi Arab insurgents stood up to the Americans when all the world scurried to do the US's bidding. The Iraqi insurgency saved the world from American hegemony, and started a chain of events that caused the US permanent war, homeland security, national security state and military empire to implode.

Does anyone here think that the US national security state's collapse is going to bring about a kinder, gentler America with health care insurance and generous retirements for ALL?

Next, amongst the more intelligent responses in the thread(s), Yoshie F. wrote, in part:


>>Few US politicians -- including Kerry and Republicans -- would want a
permanent occupation of Iraq. All of them would rather implant a pro-Washington neoliberal Iraqi government and then withdraw the majority of US troops. The rub is that it is not possible to implant such an Iraqi regime without defeating armed and unarmed Iraqis who resist the foreign occupiers and their Iraqi allies -- hence the continuation of the costly direct occupation and bloody counter-insurgency war.>>

This is a point that Kerry ought to be asked to take up with US military and CentCom, since the plan is to have 30,000 - 50,000 personnel permanently in Iraq. Maybe that many troops don't seem like 'occupation' to the scurrying compradore states of Germany, S. Korea, and Japan, but that's what makes Iraqis different. They see it otherwise.

The US military and government were warned right from the beginning that if they stayed 1-2 years with a clear-cut exit plan, they would be seen as friends and liberators of Iraq (who had at least made up somewhat for their barbaric behaviour of the previous decade). If they tried to stay longer and did not make their intentions to leave clear, all of Iraq would turn against them (even religious and Iraqi nationalist Kurds).

Taking one too many cues from Zion, they thought they could be clever, that they could crack down, brutally beat down further a defeated people, and then foment mistrust and even fratricidal violence using terrorism. This would give them the compliant puppet state that would house their troops and pump oil to pay for this 'protection'. In the language of the US military (where they walk the talk), THEY STARTED TO BELIEVE THEIR OWN BULLSHIT.

Perhaps, though, the world historic turning point was the armed insurrection of Okinawans against the US military there back in the 1960s-70s, which at least forced the US military to give back some of Okinawa to the Okinawans. Had the Japanese part of the deal had any independence, the obtrusive US military presence there would be long gone.

The Iraqis know the score: no more Palestines, no more Okinawas, no more Guantanamos!

Yes, America, the Iraqis are fighting for your freedom, too.

F

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