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Leninist"</title></head><body>
<div>Chris Doss wrote:</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>Wait a second, I'm a fan of Kerensky and a defender of Stalin at
the same</div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>time? I can be all things to all
people!</blockquote>
<div><br></div>
<div>Why not? Until Lenin's return, "Stalin" supported
the Provisional</div>
<div>Government--and that was when it was composed of even</div>
<div>less "democratic" figures than Kerensky.</div>
<div><br></div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite> </blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>By the way, I'm still waiting for
Trotsky's inevitable revolution in Europe that was the only thing that
could save the Soviet Union from Hitler.</blockquote>
<div><br></div>
<div>More falsification. Trotsky always left no doubt that he
viewed</div>
<div>the defeat of Hitler as inevitable. He said that
proletarian revolution</div>
<div>("social" in the rest of the world but "political"
in the then-USSR)</div>
<div>was the only thing that could save the USSR from capitalist</div>
<div>restoration *by the Stalinist bureaucracy*. Of course,
no-one</div>
<div>nowadays thinks that was anything but fantasy. As we all
know,</div>
<div>socialism was definitively established by "Stalin" and
could never,</div>
<div>ever, be overthrown!</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>Shane Mage<br>
<br>
"Thunderbolt steers all
things." <span
></span
> <span
></span
> <span
></span
> <span
></span
> <span
></span> <br>
</div>
<div>Herakleitos of Ephesos, fr. 64</div>
<div><br></div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite><br>
<i><b>Shane Mage <shmage@pipeline.com></b></i> wrote:<br>
<blockquote>Chris Doss has long left no doubt about his preference for
the</blockquote>
<blockquote>"February Revolutionaries" Miliukov and Kerensky
as against</blockquote>
<blockquote>the "October Revolutionaries," those
"assholes," those</blockquote>
<blockquote>"irresponsible adventurists," Lenin and
Trotsky. Soit. But he</blockquote>
<blockquote>should not be allowed to get away with blatant
falsifications:</blockquote>
<blockquote><br></blockquote>
<blockquote>1.) "land to the peasants" could not have
taken place at all</blockquote>
<blockquote> without the
"October" overthrow of his "February"
favorites;</blockquote>
<blockquote> peasant landownership
was absolutely untouched until 1929-1930;</blockquote>
<blockquote> the miltarized forced
collectivization was not the work of</blockquote>
<blockquote> the "October"
Bolsheviks but that of their murderer.</blockquote>
<blockquote><br></blockquote>
<blockquote>2.) There was nothing "hypothetical" about
"revolution in</blockquote>
<blockquote> Germany," as the
Kaiser found out in less than a year.</blockquote>
<blockquote><br></blockquote>
<blockquote>3.) The Bolsheviks took power under conditions of
*imperialist*</blockquote>
<blockquote> war, not of civil
war. "October" ended the imperialist war</blockquote>
<blockquote> in the East.
"February" regrouped and began the civil war</blockquote>
<blockquote> that bled
"October" white and, in the absence of
successful</blockquote>
<blockquote> European socialist
revolutions, led to the Imperial</blockquote>
<blockquote> restoration under
Yusef.</blockquote>
<blockquote><br></blockquote>
<blockquote>Shane Mage<br>
<br>
"Thunderbolt steers all
things." <span
></span
> <span
></span
> <span
></span
> <span
></span
> <span
></span> <br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote>Herakleitos of Ephesos, fr. 64</blockquote>
<blockquote><br>
<blockquote type="cite" cite>Yeah, that "Land to the Peasants!"
thing didn't last very long.<br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<blockquote>
<blockquote> <br>
</blockquote>
<blockquote>I am not a fan of the Bolshies by any means, who I think
at bottom were irresponsible adventurists, gambling the fate of 200
million or so people on a hypothetical revolution in Germany as they
did, but to be fair they _were_ operating under conditions of civil
war. There's no way to know how much of what they did was out of
ideological fervor and how much out of being backed into a
corner.<br>
</blockquote>
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<blockquote><br>
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<blockquote><br></blockquote>
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