[lbo-talk] NRA: We need more guns in our schools

Leigh Meyers leighcmeyers at gmail.com
Sun Apr 3 08:17:31 PDT 2005


----- Original Message ----- From: Mike Ballard To: lbo lbo Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2005 6:07 AM Subject: Re: [lbo-talk] NRA: We need more guns in our schools

Bryan quoted the "NYT" thusly:

New York Times Apr. 3, 2005 12:00 AM

Paul Bucher, the district attorney for the Wisconsin county where a man opened fire in a church service last month, killing seven people and himself, has one answer to the deadly mass shootings around the country

in recent weeks: more guns.

"The problems aren't the guns, it's the guns in the wrong hands," said Bucher, a Republican who recently announced his candidacy for Wisconsin attorney general. "We need to put more guns in the hands of law-abiding citizens. Whether having that would have changed what happened is all speculation, but it would level the playing field. If the person you're fighting has a gun and all you have is your fists, you lose." ********************************

Michael Moore makes the point in his "Bowling for Columbine" that Canada has a per capita gun-ownership ratio equal to America's. Yet, the Canadians don't go around using their "equalizers" like the Americans do. Now, why would that be?

I think Moore puts his finger on the answer when he hints that Canadians have health care and a safety net which they can more or less depend on. The Americans have a culture which lauds a kind of narrow individualism, the kind which is promoted by the likes of the Republican DA quoted above. On top of this, the Americans in say, Detroit, don't have the safety net/national medical care as the Candadians across the river in Windsor do. Thus, Moore walks from house to house in Windsor checking to see whether it's true that these Canadians leave their homes unlocked. Do they feel more secure than say the people of Detroit?

They DO! He goes from unlocked door to unlocked door.

So, more guns in the right hands as the Wisconsin DA suggests?

Yes.

How do you get guns into the "right hands". Provide a leftist safety net to the society as a whole?

I'd say so. Sound more effective to me than the Detroit solution : provide more armed cops on the streets to keep people imbued with rightist, social-darwinistic fantasies from using their "equalizers".

Stop promoting the notion (from whatever official authoritative source) that narrow individualism is the way to promote human freedom from the "fear your neighbour", indeed, your own family members syndrome?

Methinks, the answer to that one is yes.

Best, Mike B)

The problem is... Who's defining law abiding?

But the whole issue is moot really, until there's a reasonably "civil" society in the US that is more concerned with helping out their neighbor than getting over on them.

A gun circumvent the "getting over" part and gets right to the point.

Point being: "Do what I say!"

I sent this to another list earlier. It's in regard to Red Lake.

Talk about Feds all over the place... But they aren't looking for the Red Lake youths gun caches, as you might think...

The want the computers.

----- Original Message ----- From: Leigh Meyers To: leigh_m ; Newsroom-L Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2005 7:53 AM Subject: "Others" Aware of Red Lake Plans...

A WashPost Prop-agenda piece.

They always get the staff writers to write the prop-agenda pieces. In this one, the whole headline scenario gets flushed in the 1st 'graph.

The "Officals" DID NOT say "Others Aware of Red Lake Plans".

"One law enforcement official said the FBI believes..."

Is as close as the story gets to indicating anyone was aware of anything

"...As many as 20 teenagers *may*(em added) have known..."

Is how the first 'graph reads, making the headline absolutely bogus.

It's a sick joke, you know? Right now, there are Feds running around Red Lake Mn hassling kids, their parents, and confiscating evey computer they can get their corrupt little hands on.

Three or four kids that might know:

"There may have been as many as four of these kids who were active participants in the plot,"...

Thirty or forty confiscated computers:

"FBI agents plan to perform forensic analysis on 30 to 40 computers seized Friday ..."

A suggestion seems in order: http://www.pgpi.org/

Unless you buy the license, it doesn't integrate with OE or others, but you can always encrypt and attach.

<...> As the week passed in this isolated community, the FBI's continuing investigation was compounding the residents' ingrained distrust of outside authorities.

"It used to be when you saw someone who's a non-Indian coming on the reservation, there's only one reason -- he's either an FBI agent or a Mormon," said Mike Fairbanks, a 40-year law enforcement veteran and a member of the Red Lake Chippewa.

Some of the distrust was cropping up between tribal members.

"I've been getting strange looks," said Cartera Hart, 16, as she left a grocery store on the reservation. Hart, who was dressed in black and wore a hoop through her lip, said she hangs out with about a dozen students who were friends with Weise and Jourdain, who is the tribal chairman's son. Friend Alyssa Roy, 15, said, "There's going to be more and more people tormenting us and thinking we're involved." <...>

Do you suppose the FBI wants a shooting war with the local kids?

It wouldn't be the first time they provoked a violent incident on sovereign Native land.

Just ask Leonard Peltier, Sitting Bull, Geronimo, Red Cloud...

L http://www.leighm.net http://www.furl.net/members/leigh_m/rss.xml

washingtonpost.com

Others Aware of Red Lake Plans, Officials Say As Many as Four Believed to Have Helped Plot Attack By Dana Hedgpeth and Dan Eggen Washington Post Staff Writers

Eggen reported from Washington. Special correspondent Dalton Walker contributed to this report from Red Lake.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A19704-2005Apr1?language=printer

Saturday, April 2, 2005; Page A03 RED LAKE, Minn., April 1 -- As many as 20 teenagers may have known ahead of time about plans for the shooting spree that resulted in the deaths of 10 people on the Indian reservation here March 21, tribal and federal officials said Friday.

Capt. Dewayne Dow of the tribal police told a group of parents, teachers and staff at a three hour school board meeting that authorities believe as many as 20 students were involved.

One law enforcement official said the FBI believes that as many as four students -- including gunman Jeff Weise and Louis Jourdain, a classmate arrested Sunday -- were directly involved in planning an attack on Red Lake High School, and well over a dozen others may have heard about the plot.

"There may have been as many as four of these kids who were active participants in the plot," said the official, who declined to be identified discussing an ongoing investigation. "The question is, how many other kids had some knowledge of this or had heard about it somehow? We think there were quite a few."

FBI agents plan to perform forensic analysis on 30 to 40 computers seized Friday from the high school computer laboratory, FBI and school officials said. Investigators hope to learn more from the school computers, since much of the alleged discussion and planning among Weise and his friends occurred through e-mails and instant messages, the law enforcement official said. <...>

Tribal chairman Floyd "Buck" Jourdain Jr. appeared at Friday's school board meeting and defended his son. "I sincerely feel my son is a victim, just like everybody else's," Jourdain said. "He's equally traumatized as anybody. He's been more traumatized, because he was a friend of Jeff Wiese's. The only thing he's being guilty of is being a friend." <...>



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