> Oh please. This isn't about "scholarship" - it's deeply political.
> It's about what people are allowed to say in public, and what
> universities are allowed to teach. It's about admitting the murderous
> history of the U.S. instead of factchecking a hothead's footnotes. If
> you can't see that, well, maybe you have a bright future with Marty
> Peretz.
It's hardly paradoxical to believe that Churchill shouldn't have been fired for his odious post-9/11 comments (thankfully, he's no longer in any real danger on that score) and that the US government did really nasty things to Native Americans while also believing that it's entirely proper for scholars to inquire as to what nasty things the US government actually did (e.g. did the US Army intentionally create a smallpox epidemic amongst the Mandan?). It's also entirely proper for scholars to castigate other scholars who publish bullshit (the most charitable interpretation of Churchill's Mandan genocide claim) and sometimes fire those who publish intentional fabrications (the least charitable interpretation). I don't really see why it's so hard for you to wrap your head around all these seemingly uncontroversial notions.
-- Luke
Doug
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Message: 2 Date: Sun, 3 Apr 2005 16:51:41 -0400 From: Doug Henwood <dhenwood at panix.com> Subject: Re: [lbo-talk] Personal Attacks vs Ad hominem dishonesty To: lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org Message-ID: <p06210202be7606dcaffa@[192.168.0.17]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"
Carrol Cox wrote:
>Isn't it about time to quit giving this slimeball free space in the
>lbo-archives?
I've been debating this with myself since he first showed up. As is clear, I don't like Brown one bit. I've actually been restrained in my use of language in dealing with Brown; several times I've typed the word "scumbag," only to delete it in an attempt to stay on the high road. While I encourage a diversity of views on this list, I don't welcome publicists for reactionaries. So if he were just some generic hack I might have thrown him off promptly. But I've actually found his presence here useful - he's confirmed my suspicions of what a bottom-feeder he is. So in that sense I'm glad to have it all on the record.
But I think I've had about enough. Any final words, Prof Brown?
Doug
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Message: 3 Date: Sun, 3 Apr 2005 13:55:39 -0700 From: Michael Perelman <michael at ecst.csuchico.edu> Subject: Re: [lbo-talk] Inconvenient facts To: lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org Message-ID: <20050403135539.A6344 at ecst.csuchico.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Wow. You are a historian. Could you name 100 "far-left" historians? Which of the top ten universities have departments dominated by the "far-left"? Would Doug Henwood qualify as "far-left"? Would John kerry or Lincoln Chaffee?
On Sun, Apr 03, 2005 at 03:30:31PM -0500, Thomas Brown wrote:
>
> Finally, think about what it means to be an "opportunist." Doesn't it
> imply that you get some reward for taking an opportunity? The notion
> that I'm going to get any career traction from this is absurd. Given
> the far-left bias in my field, it's going to hurt me if anything. And the
> right-wing media tycoons have yet to cut me a check.
-- Michael Perelman Economics Department California State University Chico, CA 95929
Tel. 530-898-5321 E-Mail michael at ecst.csuchico.edu
------------------------------
Message: 4 Date: Sun, 03 Apr 2005 17:10:36 -0400 From: snitsnat <snitilicious at tampabay.rr.com> Subject: Re: [lbo-talk] encryption To: lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.2.20050403165905.04317d70 at pop-server.tampabay.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
At 05:24 PM 4/3/2005, Bryan wrote:
>Only a fool would write their passphrase down.
heh. heh. heh. Story: About 4 years ago, a clients' employee split, leaving them with an encrypted drive on the company-issued laptop.
The guy tasked with cracking his password was creaming in his jeans at the opportunity to play with h4ck3r t00lz. He was sending me e-mail every other minute, amazed at the speed with which the password cracker worked. I think it took 'im six hours or something.
Kelley
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Message: 5 Date: Sun, 03 Apr 2005 17:23:45 -0400 From: "Max B. Sawicky" <sawicky at bellatlantic.net> Subject: RE: [lbo-talk] Inconvenient facts To: <lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org> Message-ID: <IMEEJODEBGGGJHMBBOFFCEGEDGAA.sawicky at bellatlantic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Perelman. 99 to go.
Subject: Re: [lbo-talk] Inconvenient facts
Wow. You are a historian. Could you name 100 "far-left" historians? Which of the top ten universities have departments dominated by the "far-left"? Would Doug Henwood qualify as "far-left"? Would John kerry or Lincoln Chaffee?
On Sun, Apr 03, 2005 at 03:30:31PM -0500, Thomas Brown wrote:
>
> Finally, think about what it means to be an "opportunist." Doesn't it
> imply that you get some reward for taking an opportunity? The notion
> that I'm going to get any career traction from this is absurd. Given
> the far-left bias in my field, it's going to hurt me if anything. And the
> right-wing media tycoons have yet to cut me a check.
------------------------------
Message: 6 Date: Sun, 03 Apr 2005 18:43:55 -0400 From: snitsnat <snitilicious at tampabay.rr.com> Subject: RE: [lbo-talk] Inconvenient facts To: lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org, lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.2.20050403184311.04285c40 at pop-server.tampabay.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
At 05:23 PM 4/3/2005, Max B. Sawicky wrote:
>Perelman. 99 to go.
he's a sociologist, Brown is. They're all commie-pinko-fagz!
------------------------------
Message: 7 Date: Sun, 3 Apr 2005 15:48:23 -0700 From: Marta Russell <ap888 at lafn.org> Subject: Re: [lbo-talk] Re: lbo-talk Digest, Vol 16, Issue 8 To: lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org Message-ID: <a05100321be7622ea1b2f@[66.81.195.177]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"
>>Chuck wrote:
>
>Whatever. This is not evidence of academic misconduct. Until the
>recent attacks on Churchill, I had long been under the impression
>that the U.S. had conducted germ warfare against the Mandans and
>other plains nations. I don't recall getting this information from
>Churchill, so it must have been found in a variety of histories.
My copy of Howard Zinn's Peoples History is lent out but it could well be there. Marta --
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Message: 8 Date: Sun, 03 Apr 2005 17:41:47 -0500 From: jthorn65 at sbcglobal.net Subject: Re: [lbo-talk] NRA: We need more guns in our schools To: lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org Message-ID: <42502ADB.22185.9B054FC at localhost> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
> Mike Ballard writes:
>
> > I think Moore puts his finger on the answer when he
> > hints that Canadians have health care and a safety net
> > which they can more or less depend on.
Jordan Hayes wrote:
>
> Talk about a crackpot theory. You're saying that because 47 MILLION
> USers don't have health care, fewer than the number of fingers you have
> of them shoot up a school or a church now and again?
>
> You have some evidence that tragedies like Columbine are systemic
> problems? Let's see it.
I didn't think Moore was making the point this specifically. The idea I got was that US society is more competitive and insecure. The issue of health care showing that Canadians see a problem like this as something to be solved by all of society and the US favors a cowboy Go-it- alone solution. If you feel you are a part of society rather than a collection of competing individuals you might be less likely to shoot someone. Certainly not a crackpot idea.
John Thornton
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Message: 9 Date: Sun, 03 Apr 2005 22:54:24 +0000 From: sethia at speakeasy.net Subject: Re: [lbo-talk] Re: New Imperialism? To: lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org Message-ID: <W6883728357125281112568864 at webmail2> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Autoplectic wrote:
>Well, let's compare the following. The first is from Milberg's piece,
>the second from Singer's entry: 'Terms of Trade and Economic
>Development', pp. 323-8 in John Eatwell et al.
>The New Pal~rave: Economic Development. New York: W.W. Norton, 1989.
>
Huh. You're right, I was missing something. I'll have to give Milberg's paper a closer look, especially his (and your) references to empirical studies on the terms of trade.
Seth
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Message: 10 Date: Sun, 03 Apr 2005 23:16:37 +0000 From: jmhayes at j-o-r-d-a-n.com Subject: Re: [lbo-talk] NRA: We need more guns in our schools To: lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org Message-ID: <W686055816196171112570197 at webmail3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
John Thornton writes:
> The issue of health care showing that Canadians see a
> problem like this as something to be solved by all of
> society ...
Well, it does also nicely let companies off the hook for paying for it. It's not "free" you know, it gets paid for by income taxes. So maybe you mean "something to be solved by all of tax-paying society" (and see below for some more fun stats).
> If you feel you are a part of society rather than a collection
> of competing individuals you might be less likely to shoot
> someone. Certainly not a crackpot idea.
Hah! I think that's just about the definition of a crackpot theory. In the US you're most likely to shoot someone if you're a criminal and a crime you're comitting is going wrong or if your criminal enterprise is threatened either by competition or by a potential witness going against you. The next big identifyable group of people who shoot other people are domestic violence type cases, and that's like 7% (about 1300 last year, already way down in the noise of "things happening to an indentifyable part of the population").
WAY WAY WAY WAY down there is people who do it because of some vague feeling that they are part of a collection of competing individuals. And to tie this back to the original crackpot theory, nobody knows why most of the extremely few people who go out in a blaze of bullets against their classmates or churchmates: least of all anyone here on this list.
Anyway, the Canadian system isn't some kind of miracle; in fact, it's quite close to being broke:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/03/20/health/main681801.shtml
Excerpt:
"Every day we're paying for health care, yet when we go to access it, it's just not there," said Pelton.
The average Canadian family pays about 48 percent of its income in taxes each year, partly to fund the health care system. Rates vary from province to province, but Ontario, the most populous, spends roughly 40 percent of every tax dollar on health care, according to the Canadian Taxpayers Federation.
The system is going broke, says the federation, which campaigns for tax reform and private enterprise in health care.
------------------------------
Message: 11 Date: Sun, 03 Apr 2005 19:28:18 -0400 From: ravi <gadfly at exitleft.org> Subject: Re: [lbo-talk] linux and health To: lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org Message-ID: <42507C12.7000909 at exitleft.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
snitsnat wrote:
>
> I guess I'm _really_ surprised to see ravi pointing out all the
> usability problems with linux! :)
>
i am an idealogue, not a bigot ;-). plus i don't have access to good pot, so lack the free thinking required to recommend linux (or any unix) to an end user!
> I was responding to your claim that the meal was unhealthy. A vegetarian
> will obviously think so.
as a lifelong vegetarian, i don't give a rat's arse about people's health (present company excluded, of course, since many of you may still buy me a drink ;-)). i just wish that if people had to eat animals, they would do so in a manner that requires lesser horror than the current methods employ.
--ravi
------------------------------
Message: 12 Date: Sun, 03 Apr 2005 18:38:21 -0500 From: Thomas Brown <browntf at HAL.LAMAR.EDU> Subject: [lbo-talk] Re: lbo-talk Digest, Vol 16, Issue 4 To: lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org Message-ID: <5beb01c538a6$399686e0$7f369e8c at bmt.lamar.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; reply-type=original; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed
Doug wrote:
>But I think I've had about enough. Any final words, Prof Brown?
What was that you were saying about the importance of the free speech issue, as you reached for the unsubscribe button?
------------------------------
Message: 13 Date: Sun, 3 Apr 2005 16:52:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike Ballard <swillsqueal at yahoo.com.au> Subject: Re: [lbo-talk] Zizek nuptuals/age thing To: lbo lbo <lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org> Message-ID: <20050403235230.27764.qmail at web51403.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
To Chloe who wish'd her self young enough for me
Chloe, why wish you that your years Would backwards run, til they meet mine, That perfect Likeness, which endears Things unto things, might us Combine? Our Ages so in date agree, That Twins do differ more than we.
There are two Births, the one when Light First strikes the new awak'ned sense; The Other when two Souls unite; And we must count our life from thence: When you lov'd me, and I lov'd you, Then both of us were born anew.
Love then to us did new Souls give, And in those Souls did plant new pow'rs; Since when another life we live, The Breath we breathe is his, not ours; Love makes those young, whom Age doth Chill, And whom he finds young, keeps young still.
Love, like that Angell that shall call Our bodies from the silent Grave, Unto one Age doth raise us all, None too much, none too little have; Nay that difference may be may be none, He makes two not alike, but One.
And now since you and I are such, Tell me what's yours, and what is mine? Our Eyes, our Ears, our Taste, Smell, Touch, Do (like our Souls) in one Combine; So by this, I as well may be Too old for you, as you for me.
William Cartwright (1611-1643)
****************************************************************** Live in harmony with the Earth. Abolish the wages system. http://profiles.yahoo.com/swillsqueal
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