[lbo-talk] "Spirituality" vs. "Religion" -- Socrates weighs in

B. docile_body at yahoo.com
Thu Dec 1 15:10:03 PST 2005


Wow, someone sent me an excellent exhange from Socrates regarding the whole "spirituality" versus "religion" problem. Maybe it doesn't *fully* satisfy the question, but it is good info to factor into the equation. Thanks, anonymous person! -B.

P.S. My post-punk 'net radio show, RADIO SCHIZO, is still on for TONIGHT! 9PM - 11 PM CST. http://www.myspace.com/radio_schizo for details. Joy Division, Gang of Four, The Ex -- you name it.

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Socrates on "SPIRITUALITY" [source URL at end]:

This is from an analysis of the Apology.

27c. "Does any man believe in spiritual activities (daimónia prágmata) who does not believe in spirits (daímones)?" Strangely enough, Meletus actually answers, "No one" -- though again the question and the answer are really "Is there a man..." and "There is not." This destroys Meletus' accusation. Now he must admit that Socrates believes in daímones, and it cannot be avoided, for Greek religion, that this will imply gods also.

27c. "Thank you..." Socrates thanks Meletus for obeying the jury to answer, but then he rubs it in by going over the point again. While Meletus has responded that there is not a man who believes in spiritual [things] without believing in spirits, when Socrates asks the same question with himself as the subject, Meletus won't answer again. So, again, Socrates answers for him, "I shall assume that you agree..."

27c-d. "...spirits to be either gods or the children of gods?" Now that Socrates has established his belief in spirits, then he asks what spirits are. His suggestion is that they are either gods or the children of gods, which is not necessarily how we use the word now, but Meletus actually agrees with this, "Of course (pánu ge)." These are actually the last words spoken, and the last answer given, by Meletus in the Apology.

27d. "...since I do believe in spirits, as you admit, if spirits are gods... you speak in riddles and in jest..." Socrates draws the obvious conclusion. "Spiritual" things imply spirits and, based on Meletus' own belief, spirits imply gods -- or the children of gods. But then children of the gods imply gods also.

http://www.friesian.com/apology.htm#twelve



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