[lbo-talk] RE: An Appeal to Ignorance

[Marvin Gandall]

My apologies if this has already been canvassed on this long thread - I've
dipped in and out of it - but isn't the more important distinction for our
purposes not between athiesm and religion, but between liberals and
conservatives within the religious communities? The former usually see
religion as a private matter and promote tolerance, the latter often want to
impose their morality on society through one form of holy war or another.
This divide among believers affects our interests much more directly than
the validity of their beliefs in themselves.

Seen in this light, I'm quite happy associating with religious liberals and
pacifists who generally have progressive social views on most issues. I'm
not inclined to discuss their beliefs with them unless invited to do so; I'd
be concerned about appearing provocative in initiating such a discussion,
especially since I don't see why such would be necessary. I certainly don't
feel impelled to save them from an "opiate" in their fidelity to what they
call "spirituality"; in many cases, their frequent activity in the antiwar
and other social movements strongly suggests other than submission and
passivity.

In the milieu I belong to, I don't have much personal contact with
fundamentalists, but I have had some. In general, I think the
fundamentalists need to be confronted politically insofar as they align
themselves with the political right. But I think we should also be wary of
writing them all off as irredeemably right-wing, which is contradicted by
the historical record. Their religious views have to be taken into account
as one of the elements influencing their political choices, but I think
regional, ethnic, and class factors are equally important, and I would
choose to engage them on this terrain rather than the supernatural one where
they are unreachable given the strength of their convictions.

MG
---------------------------------------
Joanna wrote:


> Religion = fundamentalism?
>
> joanna
>
> Carl Remick wrote:
>
>>> From: "Dennis Perrin" <dperrin at comcast.net>
>>>
>>> Personally, atheist disdain doesn't really bother me. I view it as a
>>> form of despair, esp when it's expressed through insults or, if one is
>>> feeling generous, condescension.
>>
>>
>> How interesting.  IMO, it's *religion* that is a form of despair or at
>> least utter fatalism.  I've thought about this often recently as the
>> nation's Hallejulah Chorus rejoices over the trashing of the welfare
>> state.  Fundamentalists have no confidence at all in people's ability to
>> take hold of their destiny and shape it in a positive way through the
>> collective power of government.  Basically they just want to sit
>> passively, roll their eyes up to heaven and hope that God will give 'em a
>> job or good health someday.  Pathetic.
>>
>> Carl