[lbo-talk] From failed, surreal dreams to a plague of fantasies

snitsnat snitilicious at tampabay.rr.com
Fri May 6 15:36:09 PDT 2005


At 04:33 PM 5/6/2005, andie nachgeborenen wrote:


>I am being deliberately cryptic here to encourage some
>research and thought rather than knee-jerk reactions.

Although not at all anti-porn or opposed to sex work, I wonder what you do with research that, last I checked, does show that viewing porn makes young men more prone to believe that, if he takes a woman to dinner and pays, he deserves sex? Miles recently cited some stats on the effects of violence and I thought porn. Miles? Can't remember what you'd typed.

As for anonymous sex, it ain't my cuppa joe, but the ex-beau liked to visit the glory holes every so often before we met. There was something about anonymous sex that he liked. Was he sick fucker? I don't know and I'm not about to make judgements on him or anyone else who likes anonymous sex. And yeah, he got free hummers ALL the time. Some men at glory holes are there because they want to give blow jobs and they don't care if they get money for it. So, there's an example of giving it away voluntarily.

The ex-beau rawked in the sack, btw, so I'm not sure how his enjoyment of porn (and some of the stash he had was downright nasty) or cruising the glory holes was a detriment to his abilities or made him any less loving. This was a guy who'd leave me post-it notes all over the house telling me how much he loved me, got on his knees and proposed to me while I was peeing, and who used to exclaim, "I'll want to fuck you when you're 85" I know, I know: anecdotal.

I personally never quite get the big deal. For one, while love and all that are just as important to me as anyone else, I have never lived life where it wasn't perfectly obvious to me that, when it comes to hetsex, i was being paid for it. it was pretty obvious, to me, that my access t material goods depended on a man, iow, and that meant sex. I'm not saying that, in any way, shape, or form, did I decide who to date or settle down with on the basis of his income. I didn't have to. Even if they were in low wage positions the wage was better than mine. So, it was a difference between a landscaper's salary of $8/hr, a truck driver's of $10/hr, an engineer's at $25, or a lawyer or stock broker's at $100/. In any case, they all made more than me. So, it was love, but I never had to decide to settle down with someone or fuck them because I didn't date people who were completely jobless. If that makes any sense at all.

I've always had to be dependent on some man, and I am today, and sometimes it bugs me because I know I put up with some things precisely because I'm financially dependent. That doesn't mean love isn't there. Still, I'll never forget the day I wrote Doug to say that I'd dug myself out of a hole and I did it on my own, withOUT a man. Except my employer, who I gave verbal blow jobs to all the time. The nice things about them is you don't have the spit or swallow dilemma. :)

And, having worked in a restaurant that sold our sexualized appearance (replete with clientele that poked you in the ass with a fork or felt it their right to push you up against the hallway wall and plant one on ya in exchange for a $100 tip), I really don't get the big deal. I realize it's not the same thing as giving a hummer for $25. But, you know what my ex said the day he walked out the door?

"Babe. Don't worry. You'll find someone. Just give 'em one of your fabulous blow jobs."

It dawned on me two days later how bizarre the comment was: "OK. Let's get something straight between us (*snort*). You're saying that my blow jobs will land me another man but they're not good enough to keep this marriage together?" heh.

As for sex work. I don't want my sister to be a waitress all her life. However, when I was living with a German family when I was a teen, I started waitressing. Horst, the father, said that his sister was a lifelong waitress. In Germany, he said, there's no shame in being a waitress, not like in the u.s. She didn't aspire to move into management or go to school to get a white collar job. IT was a trade. A craft. So, why might not the same rules apply under circumstances where sex work was neither illegal nor stigmatized?

Under those conditions, I can't see why I'd be terribly upset if my daughter or son wanted to give blow jobs for a living or dance on a stage and strip down to the nubbies or give sexual massages or whatever.

But, I'm a weird mom.

Note: one of the reasons why there were waitress unions years ago was to delineate waitress work from sex work. The unionizing was an effort to professionalize the job and make clear to employers that the wait staff the union sent them were "clean" -- weren't form hookers.

Kelley



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