[lbo-talk] To Die For

andie nachgeborenen andie_nachgeborenen at yahoo.com
Tue May 10 11:35:20 PDT 2005


Yoshie, your point is unclear. Are you saying that it is silly to think that men can now, today, in a world full of supermarkets, get more sexual interest from women for engaging in risky activities that might bring them food? That it is silly to think that this was ever true, even back when if you wanted to get meant or fish you had to go out and kill it? That I am succumbing to sexist stereotypes whereby I assume that men are or ever were hairy chested hunters while women wait daintily at home for men to being them food, or at least stay with the babies while men hunt? That I am succumbing to sexist stereotypes to think if something like this sexual division of labor was ever true it might have some explanatory relevance to contemporary behavior, e.g., of what one sex or the other either finds or thinks the other finds to be sexually attractive? Or that it is just silly to hunt for abalone under modern conditions, or what?

For the record I'll say that I think it is is sociobiologically plausible, if speculative, that the well-documented (e.g., in insurance rates) greater tendency of young men to take stupid risks may possibly be partly a result of sexual selection -- that, roughly, despite the higher likelihood of risky behavior to resulty in early death, such behavior among young men may have been selected for either by women/girls who would have been more willing to have sex with men/boys who'd take risks to bring them desirable food -- specifically meat -- as a result of sexual competition among men/boys for dominance, including greater access to sex, or both. We don't know this, of course. But there is a pattern that calls for explanation. (Ask the insurers!) Maybe it has no relation to our biology or evolutionary history. But I doubt that.

As usual I addthe caveat that I do not think that such propensities are unchangeable, rigidly manifested in all environments, justified, good, or to be encouraged. Or that they are the only ones that might have been selected for. ALl of these caveats will of course be ignored.

--- Yoshie Furuhashi <furuhashi.1 at osu.edu> wrote:
> Justin wrote:
>
> >Women have traded sex for things of material value
> probably since
> >the first cave man brought the first gave girl a
> deer haunch, hoping
> >they'd screw.
>
> Other things being equal, butch men and women who
> can fetch big fat
> abalones like these
>
<http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2005/05/09/national/abalone.dig.184.1.jpg>,
>
>
<http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2005/05/09/national/09abalone_slide1.jpg>,
>
> and
>
<http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2005/05/09/national/09abalone_slide4.jpg>
>
> might get more consideration from their love
> interests than those who
> can't.
>
> I mentioned that to my partner, showing the abalone
> pictures, but I
> was told that "the water looks cold."
>
> Cf. "Abalone hunters are required by law to
> free-dive without an
> artificial breathing apparatus, holding their breath
> as they plunge
> into the current to jimmy a camouflaged shell off a
> rock. To protect
> the species, the state strictly limits the take.
> Divers are permitted
> only three abalone a day and only 24 a year, far
> more stringent than
> the limit of 100 four years ago" (Patricia Leigh
> Brown, "Risking
> Life, Waistline and Freedom for Abalone,"
>
<http://www.nytimes.com/2005/05/10/national/10abalone.html?>).
>
> "It is a risky pursuit. Abalone-related drownings
> average two to five
> a year in Sonoma County alone, said Sgt. Eric
> Thompson, director of
> the county's helicopter rescue unit. On the last
> Sunday in April, his
> unit flew in to rescue a 48-year-old diver with
> chest pains at the
> foot of a 100-foot cliff. The typical victim,
> Sergeant Thompson said,
> is 50-something and overweight and runs into trouble
> because of
> overexertion, encountering "sneaker waves," or
> hyperventilating or
> panicking in thick kelp. . . . The most shocking
> death occurred last
> year, when Randall Fry, a sport-fishing advocate and
> an experienced
> diver, was attacked and killed by what was believed
> to be a great
> white shark near Fort Bragg, Calif" (Patricia Leigh
> Brown, "Risking
> Life, Waistline and Freedom for Abalone,"
>
<http://www.nytimes.com/2005/05/10/national/10abalone.html?>).
> --
> Yoshie
>
> * Critical Montages: <http://montages.blogspot.com/>
> * Monthly Review: <http://monthlyreview.org/>
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> * Bring Them Home Now!
> <http://www.bringthemhomenow.org/>
> * Calendars of Events in Columbus:
> <http://sif.org.ohio-state.edu/calendar.html>,
> <http://www.freepress.org/calendar.php>, &
> <http://www.cpanews.org/>
> * Student International Forum:
> <http://sif.org.ohio-state.edu/>
> * Committee for Justice in Palestine:
> <http://www.osudivest.org/>
> * Al-Awda-Ohio:
> <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Al-Awda-Ohio>
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