[lbo-talk] We can lose, or we can just lose later

[Gar Lipow]

On 11/26/05, Travis Fast <tfast at yorku.ca> wrote:
> Would not this question be posed better as one of strategy?  It seems to
> me that one does not need to be 'thankful' for the soldiering provided
> by troops in Iraq but can at the same time be sympathetic.  The point is
> the war is wrong, the American people in the aggregate were wrong to
> support the war via acts of commission and omission and their political
> representatives were wrong.  This being the case there is a collective
> responsibility for the war.  So if boddi's argument is that the soldiers
> are no more guilty of perpetuating this war then the majority of
> Americans than the question becomes one of trying to get all Americans
> who supported and support the war to take up responsibility for their
> actions and make attrition.  The question of being thankful or not
> really misses the political point.  The question is what is the best
> strategy to get returning soldiers to think about their contribution to
> the war and get them to speak against the war.  Blindly thanking them or
> demonizing them is not going to accomplish anything politically.
>
> Travis
>
But Boddi is  the one insisting on  "thanking" them and "gratitude"
(as is umm Leah I think).  Almost nobody on this list is  talking
about demonizing returning soldiers. I twice gave a Vietnam era
example that specifically rebuts the idea that I'm for "demonizing"
returning troops. And  Carrol has mentioned on occasion that he was
involved in  the part of the movement that provided coffee houses for
returnees during the Vietnam war, so I bet he could tell similar
stories if he wanted to bother.  (Mind you I don't want to take this
too far. Not holding returnees a little bit responsible for their own
actions is to deny them agency - which is also a form of disrespect.)
But gratitude and thankfulness for their actions is IMO way over the
line. When you go that far, you have just conceded most of the
premises of a particular form of military-worshipping right wing
extremism.