<div> Nobody is "condoning the contempt and disgust of teachers." But Joanna (and now Andie, it seems) is shifting the focus away from the real frustrations teachers have with blase students to alleging bilious attitudes on the part of faculty. The answer to Soviet Era incompetence was not, as the old joke went, "look at the racism in the United States." There are burnt-out profs who've given up on teaching and there are students wasting their own time in college. Both statements are true. Both need to be remedied.This isn't a contest over whose class wounds are deeper.    </div> <div> </div> <div>Mike Hirsch  </div> <div>On 10/20/05, andie nachgeborenen <<a href="mailto:andie_nachgeborenen@yahoo.com">andie_nachgeborenen@yahoo.com</a>> wrote: <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">Your point? Relevance to anything? We are supposed to condone the contempt and disgust of teachers for their student's ignorance (when, after all, if they weren't ignoerant theyt wouldn't have to take the class) and even laziness because some kids thirty-five years ago had the leisure to demonstrate while others had to work? --- Gary? <<a href="mailto:slade.g@gmail.com">slade.g@gmail.com</a>> wrote: > On 10/18/05, joanna <<a href="mailto:123hop@comcast.net">123hop@comcast.net</a>> wrote: > >  Man, I hate it when profs dump on students. > Sudents are students. They're > > big kids, just hardly starting to disentangle > themselves from their parents, > > while looking into the looming abyss of the 9-5. > > > >  C'mon. > > > >  Joanna > > > > let's shed a tear for the poor student, back when > Tariq Ali was a > student, sitting-in and generally demonstrating like > some pompous ass > working class Britain was leaving school at fifteen, > little kids > already in the abyss of 9-5. > > Gary? > ride si sapis > > ___________________________________ > <a href="http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk">http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk</a> > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 <a href="http://mail.yahoo.com">http://mail.yahoo.com</a> ___________________________________ <a href="http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk">http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk </a> </blockquote></div> -- ________________________________________ `And these words shall then become Like oppression's thundered doom Ringing through each heart and brain, Heard again -- again -- again-- `Rise like Lions after slumber In unvanquishable number-- Shake your chains to earth like dew Which in sleep had fallen on you-- Ye are many -- they are few.' --------Shelley, "The Mask of Anarchy: Written on the Occasion of the Massacre at Manchester" [1819]