[lbo-talk] re: Paradox

andie nachgeborenen andie_nachgeborenen at yahoo.com
Thu Dec 21 19:44:34 PST 2006


OK, I guess I havce to say this is capital letters, because apparently I am not being clear any other way: I DO NOT SUPPORT AND DO NOT ADVOCATE SUPPORT FOR CAPITALIST EUROPE. I do, however, like a lot of European social programs. Also, although I haven't discussed it before, I will say in capital letters also, just to be clear, I SUPPORT OPEN BORDERS AMONG ALL COUNTRIES REGARDLESS OF NOMINAL CITIZENSHIP.

--- Angelus Novus <fuerdenkommunismus at yahoo.com> wrote:


>
> andie nachgeborenen:
>
> > The distance between what it is like here for an
> > ordinary middle class American and what it's like
> > for Germans or any citizens of the richer European
>
> > countries is as great as between your condition
> and
> > socialist revolution.
>
> But that's the key phrase isn't it: Germans or any
> *citizens* of the richer European countries.
>
> The gulf between what it is like for German or
> European *citizens* and what it is like for the
> non-citizens of those countries is just as vast as
> any
> that you describe.
>
> Any concrete improvement of living standards on this
> basis is privilege and exclusion, and not
> emancipatory
> in content.
>
> That is why, despite some of the horrifying shit
> being
> said on this very list regarding immigrants, the
> demand for open borders and freedom of movement is a
> minimum consense position for the left. Any
> movement
> which rejects this is not emancipatory in content,
> and
> does not deserve any political support.
>
> And this is why Fortress Europe does not deserve any
> political support. It is one thing for Yoshie and
> Carrol to advocate *taking advantage* of fissures
> between Fortress Europe and the American hegemon. I
> have my doubts about the efficacy of such a
> strategy,
> but that is different than calling for support for
> the
> EU states (and BTW, I apologize for wrongly
> attributing that position to you. I didn't realize
> you were engaging in abstract considerations from
> that
> perspective rather than advocating for it).
>
>
>
>
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