Genocide in Iraq and Sudan Re: [lbo-talk] MPug Rats Out YoshieToCooper

[Jordan Hayes]

>> There's no definition that I'm aware of that would come anywhere 
>> near
>> make it "surely" that the deaths in Iraq were "genocide" since a
>> precondition is the intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a 
>> national,
>> ethnic, racial, or religious group.  You're welcome to correct me on
>> this one.
>
> I agree with you, but is there any evidence that the Sudanese
> government surely intended to destroy, in whole or in part, a
> national, ethnic, racial, or religious group, as opposed to killing a
> lot of people and creating conditions that cause deaths of a lot of
> people in the course of a counter-insurgency campaign?

Wow, that was a quick change -- now you're pushing the contrapositive?


> If not, genocides in Iraq and Sudan are comparable ...

Um, no, they aren't comparable in any useful sense.  You can't say that

a) What's happening in the Sudan is labelled genocide
b) There's no proof it is
c) Therefore, Iraq is just as much genocide as Sudan!

Unless you say that "There is no genocide in Iraq" -- which is 
certainly not what you said.  After I sent my first note about this, I 
thought: well, maybe Yoshie is just being cheeky.  But now I think 
you're being disingenuous.


> To my knowledge, there is no consensus outside the USA that the civil
> war in Sudan has led to a government-organized genocide, and even in
> the USA, it may not be agreed upon by American Arabs and Muslims.

I have no opinion on this topic; if you're right, there's still no 
genocide in Iraq.

/jordan