[lbo-talk] Liberalism

[Robert Wrubel]

Carroll:  I hate arguments for argument's sake, but I have to point out that most Americans, young and old, believe that America generally acts for noble motives in the world, and the one "fact" they (the older generation, at least) have to support that is the Marshall plan. This is not a case of a "theory creating a fact",  but a "theory" (or superficial, second-hand opinion) that needs to be debunked by more facts.

Carrol Cox <cbcox at ilstu.edu> wrote:  

Robert Wrubel wrote:
> 
> I'd say intellectuals are concerned with "facts" before ideas. 

There is no such thing as a pure fact: the facts are, essentially,
created by theory. If the cow goes dry, it is because a witch put a
spell on it. That is, really, a fact, and if you depend on facts in 1650
then you have to believe that your neighbor is a witch when your cow
goes dry. It is a new theory, not new facts, that undercuts that fact.
This vicious circle of the theory creating the facts that confirm it can
be broken only by events, practices, which demand a new theory, and
hence a new way of parsing the world to derive facts from it. Facts are
a dime a dozen and utterly meaningless in themselve. A failure to
recognize this is _one_ of the chief forces which generate ideology (or
common sense understanding of cause).

Facts are what young Americans dont have a lot of, 

Nonsense. Young americans are overloaded with facts, as is everyone
else; it's just that the facts they know don't match _your_ ideas of
what a fact is.

Carrol

___________________________________
http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk