[lbo-talk] barbaric?

James Heartfield Heartfield at blueyonder.co.uk
Mon Mar 5 13:47:46 PST 2007


I seemed to have irritated a few people when I said that people were not so badly off in the US. (See below)

It is funny how fashions change. I recall that when I was posting on the 'Marxism-Thaxis' list I used to get told off for saying the opposite - that US workers were exploited. see: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/pipermail/marxism-thaxis/1998-August/011125.html

Then the fashion was for everyone to bemoan the excessive living standards of the US population. Then everyone used to say that the US consumer was stuffing his fat face, parasitic upon super-profits from the third world. But for some reason I can't remember I seem to have felt duty bound to insist that no, it was the US worker who was being exploited.

In fact, come to think of it, most listers here do think that US citizens consume too much energy (in which case, just to be provocative, you ought to be pleased if US living standards are held down, as this will reduce energy consumption, whereas a rise in wages would lead to a great increase in it.)

Still, some still want to say the opposite, that the US worker is suffering terrible exploitation.

Just to state the obvious: yes, across the board social inequality has been rising in the developed world, or to put it another way, US workers wages, relative to the incomes of other classes, have fallen. And, as Marx and Alex agree, relative wages are important for the way people feel. Waht's more, as the sole source of additional value, the working class create all the wealth in society, so that social inequality is nothing but exploitation.

However, just as important is that workers wages on the long trend are increasing absolutely (or, at the risk of confusing the issue, they are rising relative to what they were). And here I do not mean monetary wages, but the goods that the wages command. To put it in straight language, living standards have risen. (it is just that they have not risen anything like as fast as they have for the employing class.)

There is no contradiction there. Smaller slice of a bigger cake can still be more cake.

---------------

andie nachgeborenen

"The benefits of the US's increase in wealth and productivity over the last 30 or so years have accrued to a very tiny minority"

Alex

"People perceive their problems relative to their own society and situation, not to some absolute standard. Pointing out that other people are worse off isn't very helpful."

Doug:

"as every Marxist knows, all that wealth (and don't forget that there's a lot of poverty here for a rich country) comes at some human cost"



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