Jim Straub
I'm not so active on the list right now but this topic does sound like fertile ground for the lobsters. Charles' assertion has me wondering: do any reasonable radicals still regard china as being on the march to socialism, like, for real? I'm not even entirely unsympathetic to what China is up to in general, but I thought it was universally accepted on the left that they're not really heading to socialism through capitalism anymore. I know there's enough sects out there for there to be a few groups (and a few dozen splinters of those) who believe anything, but here on this list, are there people who would take up the position and carry the banner, that china is still doing it for the great red utopia of proletarian communism for the future?
^^^^^^^ CB: I'm a very reasonable radical, and I take the CCP at their word. There are others on the left who do, so it's not universal to disbelieve them regarding their goal. In other words, I don't think the CCP is aiming to become a capitalist class.
As to whether it is possible, that's probably a question. It's never been tried before (smile).
I'd say "utopia" is the exact wrong word to describe the goal. The Chinese Party is extremely realistic/scientific in its current program. The bypassing capitalism road wasn't working. So,they took the difficult and unidealistic step of trying to go through capitalism to socialism. Damn the Western left critics, full speed ahead.
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As to Doug's proposition, I concur. But- Freedom Road has struck me as having a good and reasonable take on a mostly old-school m-l-m program. I kinda doubt their left refoundation thing is gonna happen and reposition parties on the bolshevik model to make the rev happen, but, they do a better job than anyone else of seeming to think deeply about how to get moving in that direction again.
Jim