[lbo-talk] why Obama will have to kill some Muslims soon

andie nachgeborenen andie_nachgeborenen at yahoo.com
Sat Nov 8 20:45:31 PST 2008


Do you suppose this is just deliberately provocative, basically trying to force his hand to continue essentially Bushite policies? On the theory that they hurt us worse than anything that al-Q and its allies could do to us? It's gotta be, unless it is total cluelessness. It's certainly not constructive if what is sought is disengagement of the US from Middle East conflicts.

--- On Sat, 11/8/08, Doug Henwood <dhenwood at panix.com> wrote:


> From: Doug Henwood <dhenwood at panix.com>
> Subject: [lbo-talk] why Obama will have to kill some Muslims soon
> To: "lbo-talk" <lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org>
> Date: Saturday, November 8, 2008, 2:42 PM
> <http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/08/world/middleeast/08jihadi.html>
> New York Times - November 8, 2008
>
> Jihadi Leader Says Radicals Share Obama Victory
> By MICHAEL SLACKMAN and SOUAD MEKHENNET
>
> DUBAI, United Arab Emirates — The leader of a jihadi
> group in Iraq argued Friday that the election of Barack
> Obama as president represented a victory for radical Islamic
> groups that had battled American forces since the invasion
> of Iraq.
>
> The statement, which experts said was part of the
> psychological duel with the United States, was included in a
> 25-minute audiotaped speech by Abu Omar al-Baghdadi, leader
> of the Islamic State of Iraq, an umbrella organization that
> claims ties to Al Qaeda. Mr. Baghdadi’s statement was
> posted on a password-protected Web site called Al Hesbah,
> used to disseminate information to Islamic radicals.
>
> In his address, Mr. Baghdadi also said that the election of
> Mr. Obama — and the rejection of the Republican candidate,
> Senator John McCain — was a victory for his movement, a
> claim that has already begun to resonate among the radical
> faithful. In so doing Mr. Baghdadi highlighted the challenge
> the new president would face as he weighed how to remove
> troops from Iraq without also giving movements like Al Qaeda
> a powerful propaganda tool to use for recruiting.
>
> “And the other truth that politicians are embarrassed to
> admit,” Mr. Baghdadi said, “is that their unjust war on
> the houses of Islam, with its heavy and successive losses
> and the continuous operations of exhaustion of your power
> and your economy, were the principal cause of the collapse
> of the economic giant.”
>
> The audio statement came amid a very public discussion in
> the Middle East over what Mr. Obama’s election meant for
> the future — and what it said about the past. Most of the
> public reaction, in newspapers and on television and radio
> stations, was euphoric, with many commentators marveling at
> the election of a black man whose father was from a Muslim
> family. There was a general assessment that Mr. Obama’s
> election was a repudiation of the course taken by President
> Bush and his inner circle over the past eight years.
>
> “Obama’s election was a message against such
> destruction, against unjustified wars, wars that are fought
> with ignorance and rashness, without knowledge of their
> arenas or the shape of their surroundings,” wrote Ghassan
> Charbel in Thursday’s issue of the Saudi-owned, pan-Arab
> daily newspaper Al Hayat. “It was a message against the
> pattern that became a burden on the U.S. and transformed the
> U.S. into a burden on the world.”
>
> Some even pointed to Mr. Obama’s election as a lesson to
> the rest of the region. In Kuwait, Sheik Hamed al-Ali, an
> Islamic scholar known for his support of jihadi fighters,
> posted a message titled “We Want Change!” on his Web
> site.
>
> Sheik Ali said, “It remains the obligation of our Islamic
> nation to benefit from this example and request change,
> also, and to get rid of any regime that leads with ignorance
> and injustice, plunders from the country, enslaves the
> worshipers, drives us to destruction.” The comments were
> then circulated on other Islamic Web forums.
>
> But there was also a growing chorus of caution, as
> commentators began to try to tamp down expectations of any
> change in American policies in the region. And other
> commentators echoed Mr. Baghdadi’s view that the election
> was a victory for the insurgents in Iraq, the Taliban in
> Afghanistan, Hamas in the Gaza Strip and Hezbollah in
> southern Lebanon.
>
> “It would be no exaggeration to say that we Arabs and
> Muslims were the main unseen voters who decided the outcome
> of these elections,” wrote Abdelbari Atwan in
> Wednesday’s issue of the London-based pan-Arab daily
> newspaper Al Quds Al Arabi.
>
> He wrote, “The transformation that will begin in the U.S.
> starting today in various political, economic, military, and
> social domains may well have been delayed for decades, had
> the new American century been crowned with victory, and had
> the situation in Iraq and Afghanistan taken the directions
> sought by the neo-cons — in other words, had there been
> political stability and economic prosperity, and had the
> citizens of the two countries targeted by the U.S.’s
> designs been totally subjugated by it.”
>
> Mr. Baghdadi also used his address to offer Mr. Obama an
> unlikely deal, one certain to do little to bring any
> resolution to the conflict between radical Islamic groups
> and the United States. He offered a truce of sorts in
> exchange for the removal of all forces from the region.
>
> “On behalf of my brothers in Iraq, Afghanistan, Somalia
> and Chechnya, I offer you what is better for you and us: you
> return to your previous era of neutrality, you withdraw your
> forces, and you return to your homes,” Mr. Baghdadi said.
> “You do not interfere in the affairs of our countries,
> directly or indirectly. We in turn will not prevent commerce
> with you, whether it is in oil or otherwise, but with
> fairness, not at a loss.”
>
> Faris bin Hizam, an expert on Al Qaeda, said the offer of a
> trade relationship had struck a new note. “How can he call
> for establishing a relationship with the United States if it
> withdraws?” Mr. Bin Hizam said. “The main principle of
> Al Qaeda prohibits any relation with infidels.”
>
> Marwan Shehadeh, a Jordanian researcher and expert in
> radical Islamic groups, said that Al Qaeda leaders outside
> Iraq might balk at such a relationship, but that jihadis
> might view Mr. Obama’s election as an opportunity.
>
> “Of course there is a shift, because there is a new
> president who came from an oppressed class, and people who
> had little opportunity,” Mr. Shehadeh said. “He wants to
> give Obama the chance to make a change, since Obama has no
> previous animosity with Islam.”
>
> Intelligence officials working in the region said that they
> did not see Mr. Obama’s election as having any fundamental
> effect on Al Qaeda, and that any talk of a truce was likely
> to go nowhere. But two intelligence officials who spoke on
> the condition of anonymity because of the nature of their
> work said that they were concerned that any step that could
> be perceived as a victory for Al Qaeda, like pulling troops
> out of Iraq right away, would only strengthen its ability to
> recruit.
>
> “If he withdraws the soldiers from Iraq before the
> country gets really stable, Al Qaeda will see it as their
> victory, and they might get stronger again,” one regional
> intelligence official said. That dynamic was already
> beginning to play out on Al Hesbah.
>
> As with other Web sites, it is impossible for an outsider
> to verify the identity, or integrity, of posted comments.
> But experts recognize Al Hesbah as the one remaining online
> forum for those aligned with Al Qaeda, after two other Web
> sites were apparently hacked and taken offline.
>
> On the same day Mr. Baghdadi posted his statement, others
> chatted about the need to continue the fight against the
> United States. “All of them are low and dirty, and their
> hatred of Islam is the same,” one participant wrote. Of
> Mr. Obama, he wrote, “Even in his speech rejoicing his
> victory he said, ‘To those who fight us, we will defeat
> you.’ Let us see who will be victorious.”
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