[lbo-talk] Blue Dogs cashing in

[Miles Jackson]

ravi wrote:
> On Jul 27, 2009, at 12:30 AM, Miles Jackson wrote:
>> Julio Huato wrote:
>>
>>> My point is not that morality or a particular set of moral precepts
>>> *should be* the basis for the political struggle.
>>> My point is that morality (the distinction between right and wrong,
>>> good and bad in human relations) *is* a source and element of the
>>> actually existing collective struggles that constitute what we call
>>> the working-class or left-wing movement or socialism or what have you.
>>
>> I know we've had this discussion before, but I will offer my opposing 
>> perspective for consideration: moral distinctions are the product of 
>> collective struggles, not the source of them.  To attribute the 
>> causes of complex social movements to individual moral beliefs is 
>> capitalist ideology through and through.
>
>
>
> Sometimes I feel some of you are blinded by your ideology of choice. 
> You seem to be writing as if there were no human societies and 
> practices, collective struggles, etc., before capitalism, rather than 
> make the more defensible point that capitalism can and has 
> incorporated, accommodated or neutered many of these forms of 
> struggles. Carrol has accused me of calling everything that is 
> problematic "scientism". Often, "capitalism" seems to serve  such a 
> purpose in these debates. I may be wrong,
>
>     --ravi

I do not deny the existence of collective struggles and social practices 
before (or after!) capitalism.  However, the capitalist economic system 
is woven into the fabric of our society in both obvious and subtle 
ways.  For me, the notion that individual thought is the wellspring of 
social change is counterproductive, because it reproduces the capitalist 
ideology of the autonomous individual in charge of his own destiny 
(you're poor?  It's your own damn fault!).

Miles