[lbo-talk] Occupy Oakland's imminent implosion and the widereffects

Gar Lipow gar.lipow at gmail.com
Sun Nov 6 14:28:03 PST 2011


On Sun, Nov 6, 2011 at 1:54 PM, Charles Turner <vze26m98 at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sun, Nov 6, 2011 at 3:50 PM, Max Sawicky <sawicky at verizon.net> wrote:
>
>> What is incontrovertible to me is the disgrace of initiating actions that
>> facilitate police attacks on those who did not choose to participate or in
>> any way endorse such action. I am not saying that is what happened in
>> Oakland, I wasn't there, but any apologies for such practices are beyond
>> the pale.
>
> Well, that's the accusation here, that they drew the police to the OO
> camp. Not too smart from a military viewpoint:
>
> <http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2011/11/04/18697383.php>
>
> "...and watching black bloc-ers run from the cops and not protect the
> camp their actions had endangered,... I saw black bloc kids running
> from the camp while it was under police assault, and as someone who
> spent about two hours negotiating and assisting in the care of an
> ostensibly homeless man from the camp, hit by a rubber bullet in the
> camp, while black bloc kids ran away..."
>
>> We are not quite armed maoist guerrillas swimming in the sea of the people
>> in opposition to a brutal dictatorship.  We're not the French resistance
>> under Nazi occupation.
>
> Or even the Yippies during the DC May Day protests of 1971. At the
> least, those actions were supported by the vast majority of draft age
> youth in Northwest Washington, and would have turned out very
> differently if not.
>

I have been involved in activism since the 80's. And I have never seen vandalism even against deserving targets like Bank of America play a positive role. In many cases it causes harm, driving people from participation in meetings and demonstrations. in others it it has no affect. But I have never seen it be positive. I'm not saying it is impossible in principle. In fact I seem to remember, but can't find backup that smashing of plate glass windows played a role in lowering property requirements for voting in the 19th century. But in the past few decades, up to and including today, I have never seen it play a positive role. In addition I have never seen vandalism have the support of the majority of an activist community. Here in Olympia, I would say about 5% support it because they do it. Another 5%support it but don't do it. Another 10% don't like it, but refuse to oppose it because they buy the bullshit that opposing it is sectarian. That leaves 80% of activists who openly are against. And every time we have a vandalism incident, we see turnout at demos drop, and turnout at meetings fall. At this point I would put the burden of proof on anyone who wants to argue for smashing windows or graffita or other thuggish forms of vandalism. That the police and the capitalists do far worse does not stop it from being thuggish and counterproductive. Nor does the fact that those doing it have carefully though out rationales. If someone pulls this shit on my watch I'll do my best to stop it. I like SA's refinement of the chant to "show your badge. show your badge".

Oh, and as to this sort of thing being inevitable like the weather: if it is cold and rainy when an outdoor even or activity is scheduled then one wears warm waterproof clothes. If people who don't own warm water proof clothes want to participate then obtaining such clothes may become an organizers responsibility. And if dressing appropriately for the weather is something starts becoming common in a particular movement then suggesting a focus on that is not Kvetching. Assholes who disrupt movements are part of life. Figuring out how to minimize their opportunity to piss over your movement is an appropriate subject of discussion, not "kvetching". One of the things that distinguishes leftists from rightists is that we are proud of not just sucking it up when people try to piss on us. Rightist are the ones who refer to people who decide not take bullshit as "whiners".

And while Oakland is very different from Olympia, I would be really surprised if vandals are more popular with the Occupy movement there than here. -- Facebook: Gar Lipow  Twitter: GarLipow Grist Blog: http://www.grist.org/member/1598 Static page: http://www.nohairshirts.com



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