On 2012-02-09, at 2:50 PM, Carrol Cox wrote:
> I think the very meaning of "movement" held by Eric, myself, others, differs
> so profoundly from its meaning for Marv that there can be no direct
> 'confrontation' of views here -- such requires some common ground.
>
> The 'policers' cannot be expelled from the 'movement' because they have
> never been members to begin with. By definition, supporters of state policy
> are antagonists of any actual left movement, not erring supporters or
> whatever. Probably there can't even be shared understanding here of the
> meaning of the word, "politics."
S it would appear. I consider the Greek CP, Syriza, and the Democratic Left party, whatever differences I might have with them, to members of "the movement" and you don't. I'll go a step further. From the press accounts I've read in both the MSM and the left-wing press, they are the backbone of the movement. Moreover, anyone other than - what is the word you are fond of? - chatterboxes understands they are not "supporters of state policy", but have been in the forefront of the protests against the austerity. It is preposterous to suggest otherwise.
I've known for some time we have very little, if any, common understanding of politics - of both the word and the substance. Clearly, when we discuss with each other, we are mainly talking past each other to others on the list. Now that we have clarified this, perhaps we can just stick to the issues and avoid personal characterizations which is just so much dyspeptic farting in the wind, ok?