[lbo-talk] How would democratic ownership and control move us towards serving human needs?

Eric Beck ersatzdog at gmail.com
Wed Jan 25 13:32:03 PST 2012


On Tue, Jan 24, 2012 at 3:39 PM, Marv Gandall <marvgand at gmail.com> wrote:


> You're not understanding the theory, associated with Marxism, of the class nature of the state, and therefore offer us only a caricature of it.

Holy crap, I agree with Marv about something!


> To describe the state as either pro- or anti-worker, as you put it, is not very useful. The state has no morality,

Well maybe not so much. This sounds like you are saying the state is empty and can be filled with any sort of content. Over the the long term, like centuries, yes, in the sense that states can only attach to social formations. For now and the foreseeable future, though, the state is always a *national* state. So any politics that uses the state will have to reckon with the limits of the national form of the state, ranging, I guess, from Keynesianism/socialism (pro-worker) on end end to fascism/totalitarianism (antiworker) on the other.



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