--CGE
On Dec 25, 2013, at 5:23 PM, Shane Mage <shmage at pipeline.com> wrote:
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> On Dec 25, 2013, at 2:38 AM, Chuck Grimes wrote:
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>> The annual reminder, reminded me of a question I've never been able to answer.
>>
>> Did Jesus exist? Is there any independent information that he did?
>>
>> Is there any historical support that any of the original apostles ever existed or were there any groups like them? There had to be something, but what?
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> The closest historical source, Josephus, is very clear about the existence of Jesus--Josephus describes the murders of John the Baptiser and the (much later) lynching of "James, the brother of Jesus." But there is now, also, conclusive archeological evidence from tombs containing the ossuaries of Jesus and his family and also those of his immediate followers who used the Great Fish/Jonah figure to symbolize their adherence to the Jesus movement. But in no sense were Jesus and his family and associates the founders of a "new religion." They were all Jews, strict adherents of the Jewish religion (this is clearly indicated in Acts). Christianity has nothing to do with Jesus or his successor, James. It was the invention of a Roman police agent, Saul (aka Paul). See the recent books by James Tabor ("The Jesus Dynasty" and "The Jesus Discovery") and the less-recent book by Hyam Maccoby "Paul, the Mythmaker."
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> Shane Mage
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> This cosmos did none of gods or men make, but it
> always was and is and shall be: an everlasting fire,
> kindling in measures and going out in measures.
>
> Herakleitos of Ephesos
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