----- Original Message ----- From: "George Greene" <greeneg at cs.unc.edu> To: <debsian at pacbell.net> Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 9:47 AM Subject: Re: [ASDnet] Black Panthers
> Don't you *EVER* take this tone with me.
Heh, George, Art and you love this , "epater le (white)bourgeoisie, "
playin' the dozens, eh!? Lay off Eric, he and I have been debating this
question of the undercurrent of thuggery in the latter period of the BPP,
for a long time, and just like our debate on Alger Hiss recently, I've been
a bit less reticent about their guilt in a legal sense, than Eric, who I
frankly think, lets his substantial red-diapers cloud his judgement.
>
> : From: Michael Pugliese <debsian at pacbell.net>
> : Date: Sun, 05 Aug 2001 09:38:13 -0700
> [ you, quoting a fucking idiot: ] [Rob Schaap, did you write this?
http://www.cleispress.com/Pages/diarypolitalidiot.html, M.P.]
>
> : You know no such thing. All a reader can do is read what you
> : say, not what you're contemplating. And whatever point you're
> : trying to make by calling people you hardly know 'white
> : supremacists' and 'motherfuckers' risks evaporating in the heat.
>
> It risks nothing of the kind. I don't even have to make this
> point. You personally know damn well that hundreds of true
> freedom fighters died as a result of FBI stonewalling and infiltration
> of liberation organizations. You know that more died in prison without
> deserving to.
Yes, that goes without saying but isn't it assumed as background knowledge on the left that COINTELPRO was responsible for many deaths and the destruction of many orgs.? However, analogue with Stalinist sectarians here, the numerically smaller number of leftists killed by Stalinists or BPP leaders, in this case, even though smaller by a factor of many, many times, does not absolve those leaders of the crimes they committed.
Last night driving back from Santa Cruz, a new friend, Thomas Seay, who was in the CWP circa the Greensboro massacre, told me of the Iranian exile leftists he met in Paris, after the Iranian Revolution. The lines of "demarcation" were stark. Either one was a revolutionary or a SAVAK/CIA spy. The various Party formations (Mujahadeen al-qualq, if memory serves, and Tudeh Party [CP, which supported Khomeini, and got slaughtered for their efforts by the regime] would go to demonstrations with chains to wallop, "enemies of the people." Much easier to assault or kill a fellow leftist, than do the same to a well guarded gov't official or CEO.
ALL THE BETTY VAN PATTER's OF THIS WORLD *DO*NOT*
> amount to a hill of beans compared to that. The issue is not what
> point *I'M* trying to make. The ISSUE is, what point is ERIC KIRK
> trying to make by even SUGGESTING that Elaine Brown might've tried
> to get Betty van Patter killed?
http://www.google.com/search?q=Alex+Rackley+Black+Panthers+New+Haven+
Michael Pugliese