> Subject: RE: unions
> > > -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Doug Henwood
> >
> >> Subject: re: unions
> >
> >> When Marxists talk about socializing
> >> capital, just what is the target (banks? pension funds? MNCs? the
> >> corner drycleaners?), and what would be done with them?
> >
> >I'm not sure which Marxists you may be referring to but Marx and most
> >Marxists talk about socializing the ownership of the means of production
> >(i.e. land, factories, railways, etc.). It is only under certain
> historical
> >and social conditions that the means of production serve as capital, that
> >is, wealth that is used to create more wealth for sale and a
> view to profit.
> >Banks, pension funds, MNCs, etc. are important for a capital(ist) society
> >but they are redundant in a society based on the common ownership of the
> >means of production.
>
> Well no shit, Lew, but how do you conceive this "common ownership"
> being constructed? Via what mechanisms of ownership and control?
> Bourgeois experience shows that these are very complex tasks, and if
> you're talking about production on any kind of scale, then you can't
> evade this complexity by invoking received formulas like "common
> ownership of the means of production." How do you get there from here?
A fair question for which I have no easy answer. But I suggest that for a start it helps to be clear about what is "here" and what the change to "there" means.
-- Lew