no joanna, please answer the question. why is someone's integrity and sensibility is even an issue worthy of bring up if they trade their skillz at hummers for cash or pony up their cash for a hummer when it is NOT an issue when we are talking about someone choosing to take a job as a plumber or to hire a plumber. we can wax eloquently about programmers' creativity even in the face of a shite class society that sucks the life out of em and not worry one whit about their integrity or sensibility for choosing to work they chose, but we need to worry about prostitutes and the people who frequent them.
then there is the luscious rhetoric below: extremely effective? heh. delivered the goods. wake up. fantasy. ? this is because viewing porn can only be about objectification of the other. whereas REAL sex isn't, right? it's all fantasy otherwise. it's all about objectification. but somewhere out there is some special realm of sex where objectification is absent. or, at least, this is possible. isn't that what you think?
>I didn't say any of that. Obviously, prostitution and porn predate
>capitalism by many thousands of years.
and so has class society. remember: it's not all about capitalism but about class society more generally.
>I didn't claim that lofty position; you assigned it to me.
when you suggest someone's integrity and sensibility is at stake if they view pornography or hire a prostitute, yeah, i think that's a lofty position. in the context of other comments you've made, such as the shallow sad lives lead by gay men who frequent glory holes for anonymous sex, i don't think i'm going out on a limb.
i don't know what planet you have sex on but from what you've typed about men here you do indeed objectify them. you have never mentioned wanting to be desired, but i guess it would offend you if a lover got wet when she saw you sitting in a sunroom and got turned on by the way the sunbeams cascaded over your hair. or the way your ass looks when you bend over to get the SOS pads.
Kelley
Sometimes we just gotta take the risk of essentialism, baybee.
>In previous posts I acknowledged that I found porn extremely effective. I
>have read my way through De Sade, Story of O, and Penthouse letters for
>less than philosophical reasons. But, once again, while that experience
>delivered the goods I was looking for at the time, I would never call it
>liberating. You can't get to freedom through a fantasy. You have to wake
>up. You can't get to freedom by treating other people as objects. You just
>can't.