[lbo-talk] Genocide, Holocaust

Bill Bartlett billbartlett at enterprize.net.au
Sun Jun 1 23:32:31 PDT 2003


At 11:49 AM +0800 2/6/03, Grant Lee wrote:
>Hi Thiago
>
>> If you think a genocide requires killing, that's fair enough, though it is
>> at odds with the Geneva Convention:
>>
> > http://www.hrweb.org/legal/genocide.html#Article%202.5
>
>My problem with that definition is that it is so broad as to render
>genocide meaningless, i.e. "(b.) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to
>members of the group." That could mean almost anything. (Don't these
>legalistic liberals know how to be specific?)

You are willfully misrepresenting what it says, by quoting the phrase out of context. The context clearly is doing those things "... with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group". You might pretend that it doesn't say that, you might even convince yourself of it, but the context is there in black and white.

Any moron can see that it doesn't intend to say that "... Causing serious bodily or mental harm" to members of a group is genocide, only doing so with *intent to destroy* that group.

Don't be so obtuse. Here it is, read it properly:

Article 2 In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:

* (a) Killing members of the group;

* (b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;

* (c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;

* (d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group; * (e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.


>In my opinion the "Stolen Generations" was the same kind of crime that was
>committed against the thousands of British "orphans" sent to settler
>colonies during the very same period and with the very same intent --- to
>make them obedient and capitalist-productive workers, in a society with a
>labour market with a long term, structural dearth of unskilled labour.

I suspect your "opinion" is based on deliberate, willful, ignorance of the different context of the respective examples. Clearly the British "orphans" transported to the "colonies" suffered much the fate as aboriginals taken from their families. But equally clearly, the motivation and intent behind the transportation of the British "orphans" could not have been the destruction of a national or ethnic group.

Incidently, the fate of the British orphans was also the fate of many illegitimate children born of white Australians. It was certainly awful what was done to these people, but there can be no question it was genocide, because there was not intention to destroy an ethnic group.

But there are many indications that it was the motivation behind removal of aboriginal children from their parents. You would be entitled to dispute this of course, but you are not entitled to misrepresent the official definition of genocide.

Bill Bartlett Bracknell Tas -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <../attachments/20030602/ee6a6ac2/attachment.htm>



More information about the lbo-talk mailing list