i find latin american immigrants in southern calif are still quite concerned about running afoul of the system. many came from hell holes created by the US -- like el salvador, honduras, guatemala, etc -- and do not want to return. many can't return, or else. they are vulnerable to being thought illegals by los emigros just because they speak with a "spanish" accent, and that's a very unpleasant experience.
the few eastern europeans and russians i know seem more relaxed but equally uncomfortable with the idea of going back. also, some of this group retain a great deal of paranoia about "communism." they fail to see that the "communism" they lived under wasn't communism but kind of national facade being manipulated by a psychopathic dictator and his buddies. they are almost totally unable to understand america's unique brand of fascism. and, in fact, don't factor fascism into their thinking at all, either the euro variety or ours. they often seem to have exchanged one form of dogma in their previous lives for another one, both equally unrealistic and equally pointless.
US immigration policy has been screening out "left wingers" for quite some time now. no more red emma goldmans or joe hills. there are examples of left wing activists from europe unable to obtain even a 5 hour visa to enter the US to accept an award. lots of former dictators and their friends, just as we still have a few aging former nazis (many retired CIA assets), living in the US. one more factor contributing to the hard right turn the US made over the past years.
the problem a lot of citizens and immigrants face who are not born in the US is the "patriot" act if they get on the govt's bad guys list for supporting anything left of heil hannity. native born retain some rights, but naturalized citizens and immigrants are at great risk.
i advise them all to join the republican party. ;-)
R
----- Original Message ----- From: "joanna bujes" <jbujes at covad.net> To: <lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org> Sent: Tuesday, July 06, 2004 8:30 AM Subject: Re: [lbo-talk] This is WAR, sons!
: Immigrants are very vulnerable and paranoid. Many of them believe, deep
: in the reptillian brain, that if they
: don't totally toe the line, they will be thrown out. Latin American
: immigrants seem to be more free from this,
: but eastern europe, russia...is pretty bad. And then remember, people
: all over the world can identify with the
: ruling class and fear "disorder."
:
: Joanna
:
: Dennis Perrin wrote:
:
: >>The "Dad" who wrote this letter is obviously typical of all too many
: >>USers who have raised their blood pressure to dangerous levels over the
: >>war-on-terrorism hype. It seems to me that they are basically the kind
: >>of people who are always spoiling for a fight; they get their rocks off
: >>by fantasizing a lethal threat to the good ol' US of A, which is wiped
: >>out by our noble armed forces. They also get the psychic benefit of
: >>working off their anxieties by raging about "traitors," "liberals,"
: >>etc.
: >>
: >>Jon Johanning // jjohanning at igc.org
: >>
: >>
: >
: >Got into a heated debate this weekend with a neighbor over Moore's film
and
: >the war in general. Working class guy, Greek immigrant, incredibly nice
and
: >open, the kind of guy who, if he sees you walking near his house, yells
out,
: >"Hey Dennis! Come and have a drink! Just one drink!" Full of life, and it
: >seems, full of fear. I asked if he'd seen "9/11," and while he said he'd
: >like to, he was afraid that it would be more Liberal Press lies about the
: >president's holy crusade. When I prodded him on this, he erupted about
the
: >out-of-work slackers who protest the war while guys like him and me work
for
: >a living and contribute to society (my response that there are plenty of
: >working people marching against the war was pretty much ignored), and
about
: >how only Fox News was "pro-America" while the "Communist News Network"
: >undermined our efforts to eradicate the 9/11 terrorists in Iraq. And so
on.
: >I knew he leaned to the right, but till now had no idea how much. It took
me
: >a half-hour to untangle as much of the above as I could, and though he
: >conceded some things, and admitted that perhaps he over-simplified a few
of
: >his points ("CNN is pro-communist?" I asked, letting the question hang
there
: >for a moment to allow the absurdity to sink in), he stood his ground
: >overall, defending a position that rests on fantasies, ideological need,
and
: >fear.
: >
: >So, comrades, how do we approach people like this? In my case, I'm in
good
: >with the guy, so my lefty takes, while strange and to a degree
frightening
: >to him, don't come from an an unknown place. But what if I just met the
guy,
: >say, after a screening of "9/11"? If, as many here have suggested, it's
up
: >to us to take what we can from the film and expand it to those in our
daily
: >lives, then what is a good approach? Because at some point you will hit a
: >wall. Do we chip at it, try to smash it, or simply climb over it?
: >
: >DP
: >
: >
: >___________________________________
: >http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk
: >
: >.
: >
: >
: >
:
:
: ___________________________________
: http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk