[lbo-talk] Moral values and hate

[John Thornton]

Hate does seem a part of it but more fear than hate I think. Some people 
hate things they fear and they fear things they do not understand. The idea 
that 'religious" people voted for Bush is overall incorrect but has some 
truth in it. Peoples whose religion is driven by fear voted for Bush but 
people whose religion is driven by different desires did not overwhelmingly 
vote for Bush. Since most African-Americans voted for Kerry and they 
overwhelmingly belong to organized religions you have to draw the 
conclusion that African-Americans are motivated towards religion for 
different ideas than the ones guiding evangelical fundamentalist whites, 
whatever those desires may be. Churches in minority communities have always 
seemed to me to be uplifting places. Places people go to be a part of a 
community, a desire to join in. Fundamentalist churches are very negative 
places. Places people go, not to join, but to hide from some external "bad" 
force. It is about self-preservation not community. The fact that others 
are there is almost irrelevant. They are there primarily to save themselves.
Blaming the religion is counterproductive. It isn't the hate of the 
mythical Jesus that is being felt it is the hatred of unknown things that 
are feared disguised as religion. People don't want to believe they are 
full of hate so they obscure their hate for one thing by professing a love 
for what they perceive as it's opposite. The don't hate queers, they love 
the biblical Adam and Eve couple with it's implicit patriarchal attitude. 
They hate but they don't consciously know it.
As to reaching them I don't think we can right now and it is a waste to try 
but that doesn't mean writing off all religious people. Figuring out which 
can and cannot be reached should be at least part of the discussion.

John Thornton


>I haven't been through all the posts in the last few days, but it seems to 
>me, we are missing something here about why 51% of the US electorate voted 
>for Bush. In a word, Hate.
>
>That's right. Yes brothers and sisters, feel the Hate?
>
>51% of the voters hate the other 49% and speaking for myself the feeling 
>is mutual. They're not delusional. They don't care.
>
>What do I think they were thinking when they reached out and touched the 
>screen for the all time nastiest asshole in US history?
>
>``Bunch of n-word loving rag head motherfucking faggots, I'll show them... 
>Thank you Jesus.''
>
>Clean, simple, pure. I like it.
>
>Now for the sake of liberal rationalization, we could meticulously 
>deconstruct the rightwing campaign slogans and show how each of their 
>issues was tuned up to evoke the maximum amount of hate possible from 
>specific demographic groups so as to maximize the voter turn out in their 
>favor. But I don't want to do all that work. Okay, some of it. Take the 
>same sex marriage amendments in swing states, all code for hate queers. 
>The war on terror pretty much covers the rest of the world and anybody who 
>agrees with them. Fixing social security, Medicare, and public education, 
>the `domestic agenda' is just more hate code for one racist trip after 
>another...
>
>Hate brothers and sister, feel the hate? That's Jesus hating you just 
>because you're you. Yes, feel the light. Feel the grace. Feel God's hate.
>
>Thank you, Jesus.
>
>CG