My wife is as left wing as me, maybe a step or two further to the left, though less consciously ideological. She doesn't do any mailing list and rather resents the time I spend on mine. She does a lot more childcare and cooking than me; I do a lot more housework than her. Possibly the latter is because she's a lot more efficient when she does the housework, but the fact she's willing to tolerate conditions that drive me crazy. She also resents the time I put into housework; she'd rather spend it with me.
Btw, unlike Ravi, I don't think that posting to lists is "pretending" to be part of a community. It's not the same as having a bunch of folks you can go out drinking with all the time and invite over to each other's houses, say high to on the brick & mortar street. But given the conditions of ours lives, I bet I am like most people these days in not having such a group of people, everyone I know around here in the flesh is too damn busy. So this virtual community is a real community. I've made real friends here, including people I know in person and see a few times a year, and have known now for more than a decade, and have made virtual friends with others I may never meet but to whom I feel as close if not closer than most people I see every day or moderately often in "meatspace."
It's the real thing. It's just that we have to do it on line. Maybe it's the difference between cybersex and real physical contact sex, but haven't we helped each other in concrete ways when some us have needed help? Don't you feel you actually know at l;east some of the long-timers? Don't you miss them when you don't participate for a while? This is 21st century community, for better or worse.
--- ravi <ravi at platosbeard.org> wrote:
> At around 4/12/06 9:58 am, Yoshie Furuhashi wrote:
> >
> > Where are the female partners of LBO-talk men,
> most of whom appear to
> > be heterosexual? What are they doing while
> LBO-talk men are posting
> > here? Doing housework that LBO-talk men are
> shirking? Or are
> > LBO-talk men, like James Carville-Mary Matalin,
> mostly coupled with
> > right-wing women who are hanging out at right-wing
> mailing lists?
> >
>
>
> I am not even sure, by LBO standards, what left or
> right wing is. I tend
> to think of the spouse as pretty left-wing, but you
> may differ. Here are
> her views (which might explain why she is not on
> LBO): she doesn't find
> particularly tricky (in a practical sense) the basic
> notions of morality
> and fairness (support for or against various isms
> and rights follow: for
> feminism, against racism, etc). She believes
> strongly in animal welfare
> or rights, and is perhaps more militant (in terms of
> opinion) than me in
> her unwillingness to accept exceptionalism in
> speceisism.
>
> She is not on any mailing list (well non-technical
> or non-family ones,
> that is) and she would probably explain it as below:
> a list could serve
> one of these purposes: (a) figuring out using
> collective wisdom what
> right/wrong, fact/fiction, etc are, and common goals
> based on that. This
> (I am putting words in her mouth) she believes is
> mostly implicitly
> agreed upon already (outside of the animal rights
> issue, which she
> doesn't expect to convince anyone outside of her
> community about), (b)
> planning actions, strategy, tactics to reach these
> goals or spread the
> facts, etc and (c) to be supportive of each other on
> a personal and a
> community level. Her experience of Internet
> interaction (mostly as an
> observer) has not led her to believe that either (b)
> or (c) work or
> happen, unless the goals are narrowly defined for a
> fairly homogeneous
> group and there is a strong undemocratic element to
> the process. Her
> cynicism (as I see it) regarding human natures
> (including her own) also
> gives her little hope that even (a) is possible
> i.e., we may implicitly
> agree on facts etc but not so explicitly, or when it
> is time to act.
>
> What does she do... more housework than me ;-).
> Playing with the little
> guy. Less time on computers. Marching in the
> occasional rally. Arguing
> with her extended family about Kashmir or Pakistan
> or the BJP. She is a
> big science and engineering junkie -- so books, TV
> on the subject... or
> the occasional argument with me about anti-scientism
> (we had a great
> discussion the other day about a recent article in
> the NYT regarding a
> science conference that in my opinion was mostly
> religion bashing (which
> she thinks is mostly a good thing to do ;-))...
> stuff like that.
>
> I quite understand her attitude. The more intriguing
> question is why do
> I post to mailing lists? I think the reason is that
> I am weaker than
> her... rather than accept my unwillingness to act I
> hope to (pretend to)
> be doing something worthwhile in the midst of
> pursuing my default
> activity (Internet anything). In this way, I can
> also pretend to have or
> be part of a community.
>
> More than you wanted to know, I am sure ;-).
>
> --ravi
> ___________________________________
>
http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk
>
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