> Gay men certainly suffered from severe state homophobia in the 1960s,
but are Reinaldo Arenas and Néstor Almendros' "Improper Conduct"
(1984) reliable sources for facts about it?
According to my friends who lived through those times they are. Do you have evidence to the contrary?
> When civil liberties are denied in Cuba today, they are usually denied
on the basis of political, not sexual, orientation, especially real or
imagined
links to the American government that has been committed to the overthrow
of the Cuban government.
Because additional oppressions occur for reasons other than sexual orientation, queer persecution is mitigated or is experienced by its victims in a more benign way? What does the existence of other persecutions have to do with the reality of queer oppression?
> Are GLBT individuals more subject to civil liberties violations than
> straight
individuals who have the same or similar political orientation and
relation?
My friends tell me that their continued harrassment is for being maricones, not for their political beliefs.
> And are GLBT individuals better off in Brazil than Cuba?
I do not think queer people are better off in most places on this planet. When you live inside a queer body and must navigate the heteronormativity around you, a great toll is taken.
> While GLBT individuals of higher classes and statuses in Brazil probably
> enjoy
better lives than those in Cuba, poor Brazilians, not just straights but
also GLBTs,
have it worse in Brazil than Cuba.
In certain areas they are better, but non-queers (no matter what their class status may be) never suffer the persecution that queers do. While there are differences among heterosexuals in how they regard queers, heterosexuals are alike in the immunity from queer oppression their heterosexual privilege affords them.
And I still do not understand why Cuba would not support the Brazilian Resolution if, as a society, it believes in equality and freedom. What is so controversial about declaring that you are opposed to discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation?
>From Andie:
> I don't mean to excuse Cuban repression of gays, but Cuba is also
> repressive on other
dimensions, notably towards political dissidents.
This is the same argument that Yoshie makes. Just because there are other methods of oppression practiced in Cuba does not alter the reality of queer persecution. Pointing out these additional forms of persecution does come off as being exactly what you say you are trying not to do: "excuse Cuban repression of gays." What does the existence of other forms of persecution have to do with the reality and injustice of queer oppression? By the same token, the existence of queer persecution does not diminish or mitigate the horrors of other persecutions practiced in Cuba.
> In those cases there may be marginally more justification in terms of
> worries about US
intervention that do not arise with gays.
Oppression is justified? Wow.
> In addition, insofar as the issue is comparative, most other Latin and
> Caribbean countries
have policies and attitudes that are no better towards gays without any of
the corresponding
benefits for poor and working people.
Why is the issue comparative? For me, queer persecution of any type should be condemned no matter where it occurs. If a country can point to another country that persecutes queers as well, does that make the persecution more acceptable? If enough countries oppress queers does that mke it okay? How many nations have to sign on?
> Brian's flat out condemnation is insufficiently nuanced, even if Cuba has
> been a
disappointment on this dimension.
How do you get a sense of flat out condemnation from my words: "He did some good things. He also did some horrendous things. They should not be forgotten in my opinion."
Brian