[lbo-talk] Russia's economy

tfast tfast at yorku.ca
Wed May 9 14:23:14 PDT 2007



>Timberlake writes
> So, you come down on the "revealed consent" side of
> what my old teacher Don Herzog calls the problem of
> happy slaves. If the oppressed are cool with their
> subordination, all is OK, God's in his heaven, all's
> right with the world. Tolstoi deals with this issue in
> Resurrection, in which the idealistic young landowner
> tries to give his estate to a hostile and reluctant
> peasantry who just want to go on serving a strong,
> harsh master like it always did before.

But! Chris seemed to be arguing that Russians were *not* oppressed by the state. He did not write that they were happy in their subjugation, rather he wrote that they were not subjugated. Chris' claim is not that Putin is perfect but that compared to what existed pre putin Russians are actually more free. You have shifted the terms of the dispute from the degree of oppression to whether or not Russians accept their oppression.

Travis


> --- Chris Doss <lookoverhere1 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > Oh yeah, one other point I meant to make:
> > --- James Heartfield <Heartfield at blueyonder.co.uk>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > "As socialists we are not supposed to like a
> > > politically authoritarian,
> > > kleptocratic, wildly inegalitarian capitalist
> > system
> > > that substitutes
> > > arbitrary force force for reliable rule of law and
> > > accords working people
> > > some goodies but no power."
> > >
> > > Well, ok, but let's not the wish be father to the
> > > thought. If this
> > > dictatorial government is growing the economy it
> > > seems silly to criticise it
> > > for not doing so when what you actually want to do
> > > is criticise it for
> > > oppressing the people.
> > >
> >
> > See, you might have a problem here. Russians do not
> > feel oppressed by the federal government. They feel
> > oppressed by the stuff they actually encounter in
> > their lives, which is corrupt police, courts, and
> > regional governments and crime (the latter often
> > linked to the former). A point I have made again and
> > again, but which has apparently not sunk in, is that
> > Russians, especially in the provinces, suffer from
> > the
> > WEAKNESS of the federal center, not its overweaning
> > strength. Accordingly, they favor its being
> > strengthened and the regional powers being weakened,
> > which is why most people supported the abolition of
> > direct elections of governors. Why? BECAUSE THERE
> > WERE
> > NO ACTUAL ELECTIONS OF GOVERNORS. The President of
> > Tatarstan was "reelected" with something like 98% of
> > the vote. Kalmykia is much the same.
> >
> > Lyubo, bratsy, lyubo, lyubo, bratsy, zhit!
> >
> > ËÞÁÎ, ÁÐÀÒÖÛ, ËÞÁÎ, ËÞÁÎ, ÁÐÀÒÖÛ, ÆÈÒÜ!
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
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