[lbo-talk] Doug, Chill. Rachel is not a liar. You have better arguments to make.

[Jim Straub]

>
Doug, I want to appeal to you directly to start to ratchet down some  
of this.  At the point where you're insinuating blanket dishonesty  
from Rachel or other organizers--- particularly after her very  
heartfelt email--- is getting close to the end of sensible  
discussion.  I know Rachel.  Obviously she's not making shit up  
randomly Doug.  I don't draw a paycheck from seiu, and altho I wasn't  
able to go up to the LN picket (I absolutely would have if I didn't  
have to work a shift that day--- I've picketed union-busters with  
rowdy anger hundreds of times and have no problem with adding a craft  
union that was clearly in the wrong to the list!), so I can't speak  
firsthand on that stuff (also don't find it very important who pushed  
who first--- it was a picket where a union was marching in to a  
banquet to protest a union-buster's speech--- would've done the same  
if a corporate CEO who just busted a union election was speaking to a  
corporate banquet, and from seiu's perspective there ain't a lot of  
difference anyway).  But on a host of other issues I've given you  
firsthand verification from a lowly radical dishwasher who hasn't had  
any official connection with seiu for more than a year.  Are ya gonna  
call me a liar now?  Think before you do, Doug.

Doug, given your opposition to seiu, I've asked you a number of  
questions about your opinion of private sector organizing gains, and  
how you think seiu and unite here's unique successes in that  
department may influence the issues behind the angst and heat  
surrounding this laborland controversy.  You're straight not  
responding to dialogue, and instead tossing off throwaway one-liners  
accusing Rachel of lying.  I'll do you the favor of not calling her up  
to bring her directly into the discussion, but seriously guy, would  
you try doing some yoga or something to center yourself before you  
write on this topic?  You're more grounded on planet earth than this.   
Show it off sometime.

By the way, to answer your question--- there were a ton of people  
there picketing who don't work for the union.  Altho, many rank and  
file member activists have come out of the shop on occasion to work as  
organizers, or say have family members who do (like rachel's RN dad, a  
member).  So perhaps that would make them part of the evil staff  
beauracracy conspiracy as well to you.  Anyhow, there are many folks.   
But neither they, nor seiu as a whole, prioritize engaging in lefto  
blogosphere debate on the issue.  SEIU rightly understands that the  
flamewars that comprise the sectarian remains of the radical left are  
of no impact or interest to the actual mainstream world of working  
people.  Sometimes some of us people who have seen the class war from  
the trenches of seiu's organizing campaigns and believe in its  
strategy because we've seen it kick ass, and who identify with the  
radical left in the US (despite all evidence to its tiny irrelevant  
wingnut status) do still engage in the debate, altho we put a lot less  
into it than say LN people or whatever.  We do things like write a  
pretty straight up email like Rachel's.  And get called liars by Doug,  
who from Manhattan, seems to know a lot more than I do about Ohio.


>
>
> On Apr 15, 2008, at 11:14 AM, Mark Rickling wrote:
>
>> I am an organizer with SEIU
>
> Is there any testimony supporting SEIU's side of this available from
> anyone who doesn't draw a paycheck from the organization?
>
> Doug