[lbo-talk] Dennis Perrin on the ecstasy of the Dems

[Marvin Gandall]

Carrol writes:>
>
> Marvin Gandall wrote:
>>
>> I foresee a Huckabee groundswell on the list as a last desperate hope
>> against Obama's developing fascist movement.
>
> Who the fuck said anything about Obama's fascist movment. Obama iS not
> remotely a fascist, nor are his followers. But if you want to understand
> how a real fascist movement might look if one arose (say) in 2020,
> Obama's campaign will give you a better vantage point than will the
> policies and personalities of the Bush administration.
>
> You are probably also right that Huckabee's campaign gives us an image
> of a possible fascist movement in 2020, and Huckabee personally and some
> of his current followers may well have a fascist edge which Obama
> certainly does NOT.
>
> But your humor still doesn't offer any grip on the very real danger of
> creeping authoritarianism (A NON-FASCIST authoritarianism) in the U.S.
> You are whistling past the cemetery of u.s. political freedom. The Tiger
> of a creeping authoritarianism described by Chip Belet is at the
> backdoor and too many people are crying Wolf! at the illusory wolf of
> fascism at the front door.
>
> The mixture of metaphors in the preceding paragraph is both banal &
> imprecise, but I've got other things to do than work out how to be
> precise here.
================================
I'd always thought you had a pretty sober understanding of the nature and
origins of fascism until your latest ruminations about the Obama campaign.
In this case, I think it's probably just another example of your
anaphylactic reaction to anything associated with the Democratic party which
has caused your vision to blur. When you do get the time, I'd be interested
to know precisely what it is about Obama and his supporters which somehow
gives you a good "vantage point" to see the contours of US fascism in 2020.
Your confidence, BTW, in being able to see that far ahead well exceeds my
own; I nowhere said that Huckabee's campaign contained the seeds of such a
development - now, or a dozen years from now.

The precondition for a fascist movement or an authoritarian state is a
powerful opposition movement from below which threatens the property and
authority of the ruling class. There is no such anti-capitalist movement at
present in the US or on the horizon. That's why I'm skeptical about the
perception of a "creeping authoritarianism" which excessively preoccupies
some list members.

It may be I'm whistling past the graveyard, but it would help if you and
these other correspondents would explain in what way your rights have been
circumscribed since 2001. My question isn't addressed to those of Middle
Eastern origins, and I'm well aware of the eavesdropping and secretive
nature of the Bush administration. But when I think of authoritarianism -
creeping or otherwise - I think first of the curtailment of popular rights,
won in many struggles, to speak and write freely, to assemble, to form trade
unions and political parties, and to vote out the government. Prohibiting
the exercise of those rights is the hallmark of all fascist and
authoritarian regimes, and there is no evidence this is currently on the
agenda of even the most reactionary wing of the Republican party.