On Nov 5, 2008, at 9:20 PM, andie nachgeborenen wrote:
>
> Unfortunately Full Faith and Credit seems to be suspended when it
> comes to marriage. The federal DOMA (Defense of Marriage Act)
> exempts a state from any full faith and credit obligation to any
> public act, record or judicial proceeding of any other state
> “respecting a relationship between persons of the same sex that is
> treated as a marriage under the laws of such other State ... or a
> right or claim arising from such relationship.” 28 U.S.C. 1738(c).
> Don't ask me how a constitutional ex-law prof (Bill C) saw a way to
> sign that one squaring it with the Supremacy Clause of the US Const.
> It's survived court challenges and there's a huge law review
> industry devoted to this question. I can provide the five most-cited
> pieces if this is wanted.
>
I know that DOMA has this facially unconstitutional provision--but how
can it have "survived court challenges" when until very recently there
were no states performing such marriages, meaning there was nobody to
be even a potentially injured party with standing to sue? Are there
any Massachusetts-marriage cases, even now, that have resulted in
decisions binding on the California Supreme Court?
And if not, why shouldn't it follow the plain text of the US
Constitution?
> --- On Wed, 11/5/08, Shane Mage <shmage at pipeline.com> wrote:
>
>> From: Shane Mage <shmage at pipeline.com>
>> Subject: Re: [lbo-talk] Is prop 8 constitutional?
>> To: lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org
>> Date: Wednesday, November 5, 2008, 5:25 PM
>> On Nov 5, 2008, at 4:24 PM, Dennis Claxton wrote:
>>> At 01:05 PM 11/5/2008, Chuck Grimes wrote:
>>>> And then there is a good chance that a lawsuit can
>> be put together to
>>>> over turn the initative. I know several women
>> lawyers who are lesbian
>>>> with partners and kids and I am pretty sure they
>> are working on how to
>>>> do that, this very morning.
>>> Done and done:
>>>
>> http://thecalifornian.com/article/20081105/NEWS03/81105019/1002/
>> NEWS01
>>> Three civil liberties groups announced this morning
>> that they have filed a lawsuit asking the California Supreme
>> Court to strike down state Proposition 8 if it passes
>>> The proposition on Tuesday's ballot would
>> eliminate a right to same-sex marriage in California...The
>> American Civil Liberties Union, the National Center for
>> Lesbian Rights and Lambda Legal filed the lawsuit at the
>> court's headquarters in San Francisco.
>>> They said the petition contends that the proposition
>> is invalid because the initiative process was improperly
>> used in an attempt to undo the state constitution's core
>> commitment to equality.
>>
>> Proposition 8 is clearly unconstitutional, but these legal
>> groups are making a big mistake by basing their suit on the
>> nebulous notion of a "core commitment to equality"
>> that would trump the voters' decision as to the meaning
>> of their state constitution. Proposition 8 is clearly
>> unconstitutional because by specifying that only man/woman
>> marriages will be "valid" in California it would
>> make invalid in California "gay" marriages
>> performed in Massachusetts or Connecticut. This blatantly
>> violates Article IV Section 1 of the US Constitution, which
>> states: "Full Faith and Credit shall be given in each
>> state to the public Acts, Records, and Judicial Proceedings
>> of every other State." Instead of resorting to a
>> more-than- dubious constitutional theory, they have to bring
>> the first case on behalf of a California couple married
>> outside California, even if they have to wait a day or two
>> for the chosen couple to fly to Massachusetts and back. The
>> California Supreme Court would have no choice, even if it
>> wanted not to (it obviously doesn't), but to find
>> Proposition 8 unconstitutional.
>>
>>
>>
>> Shane Mage
>>
>>> This cosmos did none of gods or men make, but it
>>> always was and is and shall be: an everlasting fire,
>>> kindling in measures and going out in measures."
>>>
>>> Herakleitos of Ephesos
>>
>> ___________________________________
>> http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk
>
>
>
>
> ___________________________________
> http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk
Shane Mage Shane Mage
> This cosmos did none of gods or men make, but it
> always was and is and shall be: an everlasting fire,
> kindling in measures and going out in measures."
>
> Herakleitos of Ephesos