[lbo-talk] Why Capitalism Cannot be Tamed

[Alan Rudy]

Thanks Carrol, it was stunning to be accused of orthodoxy (was I being
red-baited?!) and wasn't able to formulate the accusation as a moment in
reinforcing prejudices but appreciate that insight.
Haven't read Postone, probably should but probably won't.  I've come to this
in a different way, starting with a sense that Value (abstract value with a
capital V) doesn't exist in prior/other modes of production, but this may be
effectively the same position.  I think I can see how the non-existence of
abstract value in prior/other modes of production could generate an argument
that the dialectical complex of abstract terms associated with "labor-power"
in modern discourse - capital, technology, religion, culture, politics,
nature, etc. - doesn't meaningfully exist without the alienation of labor
from nature, the products of labor (which is why I focus on Value), actions
within production, species being, other men and public space.

On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 8:24 AM, Carrol Cox <cbcox at ilstu.edu> wrote:


> Alan Rudy: Orthodoxy?!  Weird. Western Marxist cultural studies (think Dick
> Hebdige or Stuart Hall or Raymond Williams if you'd like) hues to Marxist
> orthodoxy?
>
> Carrol: "Orthodoxy" is a pretty slippery term, so slippery as to be almost
> useless, & probably anyone who uses it is a bore. One _could_ arbitrarily
> define (all definitions are arbitrary) Williams as _the_ representative of
> Orthodoxy. Then Bob Avakian is heteroeox, as is Charlesd on this list. And
> so forth. Postone, if I recall correctly, never uses the term, but rather
> calls the interpretation of Marx which he rejects as "traditional," and
> (roughly) defines traditional Marxism as assuming that "Labor" is a
> transhistorical entity, while value-theorists from Rubin on have
> increasingly focused on "labor" as a capitalist  category, which does not
> exist in any non-capitalist society. I think something like that is
> probably
> correct - but those who throw the term "orthodoxy" about are merely
> stroking
> their own prejudices, and it is pointless to argue with them. The subject
> will keep slipping awayand no  one will know what anyone is talking about.
>
> Carrol
>
>
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>

-- 
*********************************************************
Alan P. Rudy
Dept. Sociology, Anthropology and Social Work
Central Michigan University
124 Anspach Hall
Mt Pleasant, MI 48858
517-881-6319