[lbo-talk] James McMurtry - "We can't make it here"??

Miles Jackson cqmv at pdx.edu
Tue Jul 5 08:17:06 PDT 2011


On 7/4/2011 8:56 PM, 123hop at comcast.net wrote:
> What I'm hearing you say is that all our emotions are simply reactions to a socially constructed reality. Prostitution is held in low esteem, therefore our aversion to it, is simply something that we have learned to feel.
>
> At the same time we say that the alienation of work, which is essential to capitalism, is not something learned but something genuinely felt by workers who have needs that this kind of work does not meet.

I think this the point where we diverge. For me, capitalism doesn't estrange workers from some geniune, natural tendencies that precede all social relations. Rather, it transforms social life. --And after capitalism, work will be mediated by social relations, just as it is now; it will be no further from nor any closer to "nature".


> That seems to be a contradiction to me. But, leaving aside the prostitution issue, which always gets me in hot water on this list, what I hear you saying is that all values are relative to the social relations that produce them. If this is the case, why do people feel pain in certain situations that are socially normative? Why do people revolt? What do they appeal to that isn't relative in their revolt?

No culture is monolithic with a logically coherent set of moral and political values. If people focus on some values, they zig; if they focus on other values, they zag (e.g., abortion). I recognize that appeals to universals can be an effective rhetorical and political strategy; MLK's was a master at that. However, that's a pragmatic argument about how to engage and inspire people under certain social conditions; it does not demonstrate that all revolts must be based on some universal, moral standards that float above social relations.

I'd go as far as to say that the imperative to ground our political work in some universal, natural tendencies is itself a product of social relations. We've learned that natural = good (everybody in our society relies on this rhetoric, from gay marriage opponents to breakfast cereal companies), so we use the claim that "X is natural" to support the claim "X is good". This is a logical fallacy (see G.E. Moore); more importantly, it leads us into pointless debates about which specific aspects of social life are more "natural" than others. Although I haven't been following my own advice in the last few posts, I think it's more helpful to discuss the characteristics of the "good society" without making any effort to link those social relations to some assumptions about human nature.

Miles



More information about the lbo-talk mailing list